1976 17' - Deck Soft Spot Question

[TooLoose]

Happy to join the Aquasport family. After 3 years of searching and saving I finally pulled the trigger on a restored 1976 17’. This forum was extremely helpful in gathering information during the pre-sale process.

The boat was restored in 2006 and rarely used since, only 93 hours on the motor. Among other things, the fuel tank, transom, stringers, center console, plumbing and electrical were all replaced/addressed as part of this process.

One, and perhaps the only, concern is a small soft spot on the floor of the deck, about 9 inches long, just to the starboard side of the center console. I may be naïve, but my thought is that there may be less support (i.e. closed cell foam) in this area because it happens to be where the gas line runs to the tank. I have not babied the area and it holds up, but I wanted to get your opinion on the sustainability of this part of the deck. Could it become a bigger problem in the future? Would you recommend addressing immediately and if so, how? Just want to get an idea of what a project like this may look like.

On another note, the surface of the hatches on the raised deck are in great shape. However, they are cracking a bit on the underside – I would assume normal wear-and-tear as these are original. Has anyone reinforced these or thought of replacing them with starboard?







Quite a big 1st post… I appreciate everyone’s insight.

Mark

[wingtime]

that all depends on if the entire deck is flexing in that area, or if there is some rot in the core and just the top layer of glass is flexing.  There is no support under the deck between the stringer and the chine.  This is the same on both sides of the boat.  Check to make sure the console screw are tight and properly sealed.  If they are leaking water into the core this could be the cause of your issue.

[TooLoose]

Thanks Wingtime.

The entire deck is not flexing in the area. In fact, the surrounding deck (a few inches between the "soft" deck and the counsel and the few inches between the "soft" deck and the electrical access) is solid. 

As far as I can tell - through all the access hatches I have to he hull/stringers - it is dry as a bone. I guess what you are saying is that water could be getting to the core of the deck through screw-holes/etc.? If so, and addressed properly now, would that area dry out? Would it be accurate to say that all "soft spots" are the result of water?

Mark

[wingtime]

Yup water intrusion into a wood core (plywood or end grain balsa) will cause it to rot, usually due to micro organisms eating the wood.  Stopping the intrusion of water will help prevent the spread of rot.  Once you stop the water from getting in I doubt your deck will get better.  In fact on my own 170 a year after I stopped the water from getting in the soft spots got worse once the core dried out. (it turned to dust)

[boatnamesue]

On another note, the surface of the hatches on the raised deck are in great shape.

Welcome to the club!  I saw your new boat for sale on craigslist some time ago.  Knew it wouldn't last long on the market.  Congrats.  I also have a '76 170.  You mentioned the deck was raised (see your quote above).  From what I can see from the pics, the deck does not look like it was raised.  The starboard access tray (where lines run from engine to console) looks like it was sealed with screws.  You didn't specifically state the deck was replaced when it was restored, so I'm assuming it's original.  Which would make more sense as to why there is a soft spot on a 40 year old deck versus a 10 year old deck. 

The area of deck you circled is in between the stringer and chine.  Water must have penetrated the deck via the deck screws that secure the console.  I can't imagine where else water could get into the deck in that specific area.  Kinda crazy the previous owner restored the hull but didn't address this soft spot.  Just laid down a beautiful coat of paint.  Doesn't make sense. 

Unless someone else chimes in with a better guess as to how water penetrated the deck, I'd remove the consoles deck screws and seal the holes.  Move the console up or back an inch or two and secure it with 3/4" length, 1/4" screws with 5200.

[TooLoose]

Boatnamesue

Thanks for the insight.

I should have clarified when I said "raised deck," I was referring to the casting platform on the bow of the boat.

Hard to describe over the forum, but I'll take my best attempt at it. In the picture below with the circle indicating the "problem area"... The floor is hard as a rock about six inches in from the console (from the console towards the gunnel) and another six inches from the starboard access tray (from the access tray moving towards the bow). It seems to be a small concentrated area. If the water was coming through the console screws, wouldn't the entire deck area between the console and chine be damaged?

So far, I have had 3 forms of feedback - (1) no structural support with recommendation to fill the area under the deck with multiple layers of foam, (2) drill small hole and pump epoxy into the area to firm up, and (3) seal and move the deck.

All of these would be outside of my comfort zone. It looks like you may be from the Tampa area. If so, is there someone you would recommend that I can have take a look at it?

[mshugg]

Could the screws holding the cover for the wire chase be the culprit?

[boatnamesue]

Boatnamesue

Thanks for the insight.

I should have clarified when I said "raised deck," I was referring to the casting platform on the bow of the boat.

Hard to describe over the forum, but I'll take my best attempt at it. In the picture below with the circle indicating the "problem area"... The floor is hard as a rock about six inches in from the console (from the console towards the gunnel) and another six inches from the starboard access tray (from the access tray moving towards the bow). It seems to be a small concentrated area. If the water was coming through the console screws, wouldn't the entire deck area between the console and chine be damaged?

So far, I have had 3 forms of feedback - (1) no structural support with recommendation to fill the area under the deck with multiple layers of foam, (2) drill small hole and pump epoxy into the area to firm up, and (3) seal and move the deck.

All of these would be outside of my comfort zone. It looks like you may be from the Tampa area. If so, is there someone you would recommend that I can have take a look at it?

Perhaps, just a thought, a hole in the deck existed in that area.  Previous owner noticed the soft spot caused by the hole, patched the hole, then painted the deck.  Otherwise, I'm really at a loss as to why the soft spot is located in that area.  I think more important than the soft spot is whether or not the source causing or had caused the soft spot has been fixed.  Can you contact the previous owner to ask if the cause had been fixed prior to restoration?

I am in tampa, though I don't know anyone in particular to recommend.  However, and despite your cautious hesitation to tackle this on your own, there are members of this forum who will help you each step of the way.   

[TooLoose]

I appreciate all the insight and has been helpful information in understanding potential issues.
I'm working on investigating this a bit further... I'll make sure to provide an update as I figure out the resolution.

[wingtime]

Remember the core of your deck was made with a patchwork of plywood squares, not big sheets of plywood. So when water does intrude it can run all kinds of weird ways.  Either way the water is most likely getting in thru the console mounting screws or the screws holding down the rigging trough cover.  If you go on YouTube and search for wingtimeRV7 soft deck repair you will find my videos of how I injected the deck on my 170.

[TooLoose]

Thanks, Wingtime - very helpful.

I plan to pull the screws under the console this weekend to get a look and probably at a minimum just reseal. This area maybe one square foot so I would imagine a very manageable project. 
 
Are you familiar with a product called "Injectadeck?" If so, would you recommend? 

[wingtime]

I've seen the guy hawking the injectadeck online.  The idea sounds good but I just don't see it penetrating or soaking into a wood core that is partially intact.  I think if you KNOW you have an are with an open void it would work great.  I can tell you that when I was injecting my deck the epoxy would sometime ooze out several holes away.   So even with the holes drilled as close as they were... the epoxy would flow in weird patterns. 

I would seal up all the screws in your deck.  Then see what happens.  Hopefully if you stopped the water intrusion the progression of the soft spot will stop.  Then give the deck time to dry out.   I fortunate enough to drill the holes in mine and then let it sit indoors for a month to dry out.

[TooLoose]

Reviving and old thread...

So after running the boat hard for a few years after picking it up back in August 2017 I decided to use this time to focus on fixing a few things on my list.

•   Re-core the hatches on the casting platform
•   Fix the “soft-spot” starboard the transom (finding out it was not a true soft-spot after all)
•   Removing the original wire tray that runs from the center console to the transom
•   Installing trim tabs

The hatches were cracking on the underside. After sanding down the hatches we realized they were not previously glassed. We glassed the underside of each hatch and gel coated.

I am posting as a “reply” to this thread to close-the-loop on what I thought was originally a soft spot on the deck. After three hard years of running and fishing the boat the spot never got significantly worse. We cut into the first layer of glass and the wood was completely dry; however, we realized that the original wood did not go all the way to the gunnel. You can see in the picture below a long rectangle piece which is actually foam. I was a bit surprised when seeing that, but perhaps a result of a 45+ year old deck building process. I wanted to point this out as I have read other threads where people seem to have a similar “soft” area, but were just as confused as I was with what was causing it.

[TooLoose]

We also removed the old cable tray. While convenient, it looked a bit tacky and I didn’t like the idea of having all my cables and wires sitting in water.

We dug out the foam, which again was dry, and installed a 2” rigging tube that extends from the center console to the transom. This entire area was glassed over all the way back to the transom to match the port side

[TooLoose]

Finally, we repositioned the rigging to stem from the gunnel rather than the floor. I felt this was good to keep the cables and wires out of the water and open up an additional 12" of area (all space matters on these smaller boats). After all that, the deck was repainted.





All in all, super happy with how it turned out. A lot of little "custom" design adjustments that I think make a phenomenal boat even better. I cannot take credit for the actual work; all work was done by a friend of mine and his business partner down in Cape Coral. Happy to share his info if you are looking for some work, don't have enough good things to say about it.