Hate asking this question, but got to......Why are my scuppers underwater?

[imonna 19 6]

Had a pleasant and informative conversation with gran tonight. We  put a few more pieces togethor.  I have foam in both sides of the boat from just aft of the casting deck, probabaly all the way back.  

With the displacement I am experiencing, he seems to think i may have more foam than the boat is supposed to have (added by someone over the years), and that this extra foam is holding water.  Another piece of the puzzle we sorted out is that my top speed is too low, which only would be known by someone that ahs seen it work right.  My 100 horse at 5500rpm, one passenger, standard gear is only hitting about 23 MPH in flat water.  So yeah, it would seem that I am sitting on a whole lot of extra weight somewhere.

I will be doing some test holes when back from vacation, but it could be stringers, transom, deck core, extra foam that is soaked, or some combination of them all.

More feedback, other thoughts appreciated.

And a big thanks to gran for the insight tonight

Dont think i posted this one from the spring and you guys seem to enjoy it.

[gran398]

Another nice fish...good work Bill

Yep, we had a good chat...and feel like we may be on to something. His boat had pie-holes in unusual places. Seems that extra foam was added. We'll find it...in the meantime...

Enjoy your vacation  

[imonna 19 6]

Well, I have been relaxing on Seneca lake in upstate NY all week and tried to not think about my draft problem too much, but as i approach my return home I have to start thinking of my course of action..


After reviewing the feedback from everyone it is clear my boat is sitting several inches lower than it should.  The cause is likely water weight and the location (transom, wet foam, stringers)  will require significant cost to repair.

Yes I have to decide whether to fix or part out and sell, but that is not my first decision.

My first decision is whether i can make some changes that eliminate the danger of my entire boat being at the mercy of two ping pong balls holding the water out.

If i install lexan/deflector strips along the top edge of the transom to keep waves out; plug the ball scuppers from the inside so that if they do fail, my boat won't be compromised; and install a deck pump that will pull water out of the boat (whether it be wave or rain), would you think I have the bases covered for making my boat more safe and thus usable.


All comments welcome.

and here is a pic of one of the lake trout we pulled in this morning.  Its about 5 lbs.  

[pete]

the above deck pump is a great idea,you could even make it removeable by mounting it and a float to a board and
some clips or a 12 v plug for power.also try moving some weight as far front as you can,oh yea nice fish!

[MarshMarlowe196]

Can you post any pictures of your bilge access?  It still may be just a combo of your stringers and transom having water weight... I remember seeing pictures of your tank replacement thread, and there did seem to be more foam in your circa than the earlier 19-6's / 22-2's.  Whether a previous owner added the foam or it was added at the factory is really a matter of speculation and would serve you to know what type of foam it is - if it was added by a PO, there's a good chance it's closed cell foam, which wouldn't contribute to added water weight, just the weight of the foam itself.

I knew a guy who had a problem with water in his stringers, and he drilled a 1" hole in the aft of both of his larger, accessible stringers, and would periodically jack the bow up and let the water flow out of the stringers, then plug it with rubber drain plug and go fishing.  Might be something to try.

Above deck pump is a good idea for now.

 

Yes I have to decide whether to fix or part out and sell, but that is not my first decision.

IMO, if you get to the point that you decide to sell the boat, don't part it out... just sell it.  A potential buyer probably wont notice the problem right away...  <!-- s:pirat: -->:pirat:<!-- s:pirat: --> That may be dishonest, but it's just business. 

Here's some further reading on this subject -
http://classicaquasport.com/smf/index.php?topic=3843.0

Good Luck!

[gran398]

Bill, you may have some boat issues....but you sure have no problems catching nice fish

Jesse, Fitz and Pete have a good idea with the deck pump. And the lexan will be a big plus too.

You'll know quite a bit more when you drill a couple holes. G'luck

[imonna 19 6]

today I decided to tackle the larger task of installing wave deflectors to keep as much water out of the boat as i can.

I chose 1/4 inch starboard over 1/8 inch lexan for a variety of reasons.  1 1/23 inch stainless pan head screws.

FYUI, the wood that came out of the transom when drilling could be described as damp, but no significant water although all the holes where up high.

Before and afters















I did install the plugs in the scuppers from the splashwell side.

i havent drilled the test holes in the stringers yet.  Thats for tomorrow or Tuesday.

[gran398]

Hey, that'll get the job done  

[imonna 19 6]

Thanks.  they came out pretty nice and should take a beating.  I am going to install the drain from splashwell to bilge tomorrow (if the weather holds).

[imonna 19 6]

All Righty.  I installed a drain in the bottom of the splashwell that channels any above deck water to the bilge where the auto pump can eliminate it.  i also have a plug for that drain if I need it.  

With the two plugs in the scuppers, my "make the boat safer" modifications are done.  I have reduced the amount of water that comes over the transom, i have eliminated the risk of sinking because of a failed scupper and i have compensated for the closed scuppers with a drain-to-bilge then pump-from-bilge system.

I am also working on a quick connect back-up bilge system suggested to me by Gran...thanks Gran.


OK now onto the "why does my boat sit so low problem.

I drilled a 1 inch hole through the starboard stringer, approximately 1/2 inch from the bottom and two inches forward of the transom.  I actually hoped a crap load of water would come out, but no such luck.  What I did find was wet, but not sopping wet foam. Feels cold to the touch and when compressed will give up the water, but no drips, leaks, puddles, pools, or rivers.

Unless someone thinks i should drill a hole in the port stringer, i dont plan on it.  I know the transom is wet, I now know the stringers are wet; and i know that I have aftermarket foam along both sides of the boat that is likely wet (I know the starboard side is because of what I found in the gas tank install)  

It would seem the answer to why is drafts low is obvious and the solution is not complicated.

Either rip off the deck and transom and re-build or use it as long as it is safe and then part it out and sell the hull to someone that wants a project.   Too bad too because i just put that beautiful new tank in.

If anyone has any reliable and creative ways to get the water out of the foam without ripping up the deck, I am all ears.


Bill

[imonna 19 6]

Ok.  So I love my boat but wont/cant spend the kind of money a restore prohject will cost in order to remove the wet foam I think exists on the outside of both stringers.

i definitel' have a weight problem though and I have some wet foam in the stringer, but not enough to explain the scuppers being 5 inches underwater.

So once I accept this goal is not to to be restored by me, what I am left with is a whole range of perhaps doable ideas to get the foam out.

SeaBob, I'd love your input on these ideas.

The one the I am most interested in is cutting a 3 by 3 square hole in the following places


Notice the squares on either side of the transom,a adjacent to the straps.

I would expect these holes would not affect structural integrity.  the transom is all ready wet anyway; and i bet i could fashion something that was big enough to get through the hole and pick out the foam almost all the way forward of the front seat.

Then I expand the forward inspection plates i all ready have just astern of the casting deck and get out the rest.

Any comments.  

the next idea is to open two small holes somewhere on the deck or sides that would allow my arm to get through and rip out the foam.

I am open to other ideas as well.

I know i have wet foam all over the starboard side and know that i have foam that could be wet on the port side because i can see it through the inspection hatch.

all i want to do is reduce the weight of the transom so I can get a longer life out of the hull.


i am aware that a lot of the weight might be coming from a wet transom and a wet core  of the deck, but my eye is on the aftermarket foam.
Thanks
Bill

[gran398]

You have done a good job. You have taken the board's advice. You have done everything suggested, and more.

You have a nice boat. And now, a safe boat.

Time to sit back, relax and enjoy, and wait for striper season this fall. I personally am pleased with the prognosis/interim result.

The wet additional foam...you're right, part of the equation. My personal opinion is that given the fishery up there....you need a bigger boat. Things can change quickly in 50 degree water. 24 to 26 min. makes sense to me.

Keep us posted, but more importantly...give input elsewhere. Help the newbies per a similar experience......thanks.

[imonna 19 6]

the reason i figured I'd look into removing it is because I sorted out the details and realized i am blowing through a ton of extra fuel.  If there is something I can do to reduce the weight thus fuel costs, i am all for it.  

 If not,  agree, boat is safer and now I have some time to pursue other options.

[gran398]

We have had PM/phone discussions regarding your boat...and guess what? She ain't that bad.

Sure...she's got buck teef. But so what. Some of the other girls got buck teef too.

First realization...Somebody got cheap with the bottom paint. Paint should have been well above, not below, the lower unit.

Has skewed the thinking re a correct waterline.

Additionally...deck scuppers....need to see specifically where they are placed in relation to the deck height. Request inside pic of scuppers, at rest. Thanks.

[Circle Hooked]

the next idea is to open two small holes somewhere on the deck or sides that would allow my arm to get through and rip out the foam.

Just thinking out loud here but if you even made holes tru the deck to the stringer every say 4 ft,ripped out the foam,poured new foam in then glass in the holes,would that not work,might buy a few more years before a total re do  

No offense if anyone says i'm wrong,i'm just thinking is all