Fletch's 1976 170 Rebuild

[GoneFission]

The Merc 2+2 engines don't have a great reputation around these parts.  Word is they are finickly and there is a hole in the acceleration around 1800 RPM when they are going from 2 to 4 cylinders, but they do run well at high speeds. They seem to do fine with "proper" care and handling, but not as robust as some other Mercs.  Also the idle is rough as it is running on 2 cylinders compared to others (Yam and OMC) that idle on 4 cylinders.  It is hard to make an inline 4 that runs well with a displacement of 2 liters or more, and this one is right near that limit.  You need balance shafts and other tricks to keep an inline 4 smooth as you approach or exceed that 2 liter displacement.  Merc 2+2 engines do not have balance shafts to minimize vibration, but the Zukis and Yammies do.  

Note that Mercury does not make this motor anymore - they have gone to 3 cylinder always on for 2 strokes (think half a V-6), and 4 cylinder - four stroke models.  But no more cylinder deactivation.

[Fletch170]

Good Stuff guys!

I really learned something today:) The guy selling the motor is a really great guy, and a member of the board here, so I don't want to insult him. SO, We'll see!

GUT CHECK HERE GUYS, PLEASE CHIME IN. I am looking at 3 motors right now they are as follows

1. 1999 Merc 115

2. 2000 Yamaha 115 (v-4)

3. 1995 Evinrude 115 v-4

All have controls, the Merc and the yamaha are asking around 3 grand, the evinrude is asking around $2500.

WHAT MOTOR HAS THE BEST REP? WHAT WOULD YOU CHOOSE?

[Boatdood]

The Yamaha, as much as it goes against the buy American grain.

Reasons:

No mechanical issues other than corrosion.
No electrical/electronics issues.
Idles fine.
Quiet.
Strong.

The Evinrude would be my second choice. Electronics are their weak point, and the VRO.

The Merc is still OK in my opinion but the price isn't enticing enough to sway me.

[fitz73222]

Good Stuff guys!

I really learned something today:) The guy selling the motor is a really great guy, and a member of the board here, so I don't want to insult him. SO, We'll see!

GUT CHECK HERE GUYS, PLEASE CHIME IN. I am looking at 3 motors right now they are as follows

1. 1999 Merc 115

2. 2000 Yamaha 115 (v-4)

3. 1995 Evinrude 115 v-4

All have controls, the Merc and the yamaha are asking around 3 grand, the evinrude is asking around $2500.

WHAT MOTOR HAS THE BEST REP? WHAT WOULD YOU CHOOSE?

Well, I dont think any of those engines are made any longer in those configurations and to be honest I think all three are a little pricey for 10-15 year old outboards unless they are cream puffs. Correct me if I'm wrong but isnt the Yami a cross flow design from way by gone day's? I don't remember that engine being converted to a looper before it was discontinued? I'm a Merc guy who can vouch for the 115 2+2s since I do run two of them and actually like them. Of course, hole shot isn`t a problem on an old 22-2 with twin 115`s anyway!

[gran398]

I had a Yammie like that, it was a sweetheart...but 3K seems way high to me.

[c master]

The Evinrude would be my second choice. Electronics are their weak point, and the VRO.



My '95 Johnson 88 SPL is not VRO.  Was the 'Rude 115 made VRO in '95?  Or was my SPL different?  I thought they were the same block, but not sure about the oil delivery...anyway you could disconnect the VRO - a lot of people do/did.  Frankly I've heard negatives about every brand's VRO from those days....not sure about today's engines...probably better.

I like Yamaha, although the Johnson has been pretty care-free and seems very fuel efficient.  It does idle a little rough (it's cold-natured) but it's quick.  The only problem I've had - and it wasn't a cheap fix - was replacing the diverter tubes for the water distribution up top.  This was the result of running very shallow and clogging things up with a mixture of mud & salt, which clearly didn't fully rinse out at some point.  (mostly my fault).  Also, I'm assuming there are an equal number of repair shops for any of the 3 brands you are considering.  

A compression check and temperature readings at the heads are in order, no matter which engine you choose.

ps - I first wrote, "...my Johnson has been pretty care-free".  But I knew a statement like that would get a rise out of this crowd...uh...wait...not a 'rise'...scratch that.  Er...I mean...oh forget it.

[Fletch170]

Guys,

Sorry I made a typo...it's a 90 Evinrude.....Isn't that the same block as the 115 though?

-Fletch

[fitz73222]

Guys,

Sorry I made a typo...it's a 90 Evinrude.....Isn't that the same block as the 115 though?

-Fletch

Not enough difference to talk about... Still priced too high. I think you could knock $500-$750 off each one of those unless they are cherry as I mentioned. Can you get some pics of these engines for us to look at?

[Fletch170]

Here is the Merc. I do not have pictures for the other ones.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/?cmd=Vie ... MEWAX%3AIT

Apparently the Evinrude has really now hours and the paint is near perfect. THe rude has the lest hours of the 3 motors. I find myself leaning toward the Evinrude, simply because it's lighter than the merc, and not as expensive either.

[c master]

So it's a 1995, 90 hp Evinrude?   Is it white?  (i.e:  is it an Ocean Pro?)    Have you compared the total running hours on these 3 motors?

[c master]

Ooops, sorry...I double-posted.

[Fletch170]

It is a 1995 90 V-4 Evinrude. It is Blue. It comes with a stainless prop, a top mount binacle with controls, and the wiring harness. He is asking $2500. The Evinrude has low hours, lower than the rest. Was used on a 20 foot boat, replaced with a 150. Been sitting in a garage. HOWEVER, was started an run several times a year.

I mean, I'm trying to make this a budget boat.....and the more we discuss....it seems this is the way to go.

[c master]

Fletch -

Then basically this Evinrude is the same engine I have.  I believe the OceanPros (same year) were the newer "saltwater" series, similar but with more s/s bolts.  I don't know if the OP's were VRO, but unless Evinrude was a year ahead of Johnson in development, I believe yours is NOT "VRO".  So, like me, you will be adding oil to the gas at 50:1.  For me that's no big deal.  I also add a fuel stabilizer each fill-up due to the ethanol issues.  

If I was the seller, I'd feel like we were both getting a pretty good deal if I sold mine to you for, say, $2100.  After all, it's almost 17 years old.  (half the age of your hull!)  

I have been very happy with my engine...it's old technology today, but it's also simple, light, durable, efficient. I pull kids on skis, tubes, etc. with no problem.  With 27 gallons I can run all weekend.  

And here's the thing:  Unless it's incredibly 'flat' on the water, or I'm on a lake or in the ICW, it is too uncomfortable to run more than about 30 most of the time.  A 22' boat 'bridges' the chop better and so can go faster and remain smooth, but these 17's bounce a lot in the same chop -at least on our open Texas bays.  Any of these motors will probably be fine, but I don't think you'd be disappointed in that Evinrude.  And hey, in a few years you might have the extra money for a bigger boat or a 4-stroke, or both, right?

[Boatdood]

Just in case it matters Evinrude and Johnson built two versions of the 90 hp back in those days, and three if you count the SPL as a different engine. The one I think we are talking about being for sale would be the 90 degree V cross flow induction. Great engine in general. As in all OMC engines the electronics were usually good but not as bullet proof as the Japanese stuff. Their VRO was never really reliable but if you're not using it who cares? OMC also had a 60 degree V loop charged engine in those days. Another great engine and it was generally the Ocean Pro series. In reality the Ocean part of it didn't mean that much. They all had SS bolts and stuff, but the ocean model did have a bit more.

And for Fitz, all of the Yamahas were loop charged except for the 8 hp from way back in '84 when they entered the states.

There's really not a bad choice in this bunch, but I agree, they all seem priced too high.

[gran398]

Jessie noted not too long ago that prices seem way higher up north. Maybe the economy is better/incomes higher.

Here's one in Tampa...and if a private seller had it...$1400 green money should take it.

http://tampa.craigslist.org/hil/boa/2557117322.html