76' 170 Rebuild

[MJB]

Couldn't wait any longer, began my "winter" project last weekend by cutting out the transom.  Confirmed what I suspected, transom was wet and rotten.  I knew it would be a problem and was part of the plan.  What I wasn't sure of was if I had any wet foam in the bilge.  Didn't take long to figure that out, it was wet.  Wasn't sure if the stringers would be a problem either, confirmed the foam in the aft portion was wet, don't know how far up the stringers yet.  

The floor/sole appeared ok, but after finding wet foam and wet stringers I decided I needed to do radical surgery and find out how bad the patient was, so I shimmed the hull, placed a couple straps and braces around the hull to keep the form and cut out the deck.  Glad I did, wet foam all the way up both sides of the bilge, so I cleaned all that out.  Several spots on the inside of the port stringer had delaminated from the bottom of the bilge which will require repair.  I still need to cut the tops of the stringers and check for wet foam, I'll cut in sections and not the whole top off at once.  If I'm lucky they may not be wet all the way.  Looking at the aft end of the stringers that I did cut away for the transom repair, only about the bottom inch of foam was wet.

I should also add that with the help of this site and it's members, I was prepared for what was in store and none of this was a real surprise.


Couple pics:
First cut with skill saw



Next cut with sawzall


Sole cutout




I did find a few old empty beer cans and a couple broken beer bottles in the bilge along with 3 different anchor/bow lines that had obviouls made their way thru the hole in the anchor locker.  And I must also say that once the I cut out the transom and the bilge caught it's first glimpse of sumshine in 31 years, it smelled pretty ripe from the mold and mildew.  

I was amazed at a couple things when this was constructed:  1) center stringer/stiffener was not completely wrapped, wood was exposed at transom and in other spots, 2) bottom inside of transom was not completely glassed in and marine plywood was exposed to any water in the bilge from day one.  

Plan now is:
1.  Transom first
2.  Check stringers for water and dig out foam as necessary
3.  Recover stringers as needed, fix stringer delamination
4.  Plan to add another layer of cloth/resin to the hull bottom to strengthen a bit
5.  Replace the deck

With some luck this weekend, I plan to do the transom.

[LilRichard]

AWESOME!

May I make a suggestion?  If you're going to take the time and effort to add glass to the hull, you may wish to add two... 1 layer of 1808 is good, but two would be better!

Good luck, and please continue posting pictures.

[MJB]

LilRichard,

I think your right with two additional layers, I've got plenty of 1808 from previous project and it would be easy to add.

[LilRichard]

I am assuming your old project was the 285?  I don't think I have seen it on CM... you have a few pics?

[RickK]

That's good stuff - first time I've seen the "puddles" of "stuff" still intact that they plopped on the stringers to bond to the floor.
Keep the pics coming

[MJB]

I am assuming your old project was the 285? I don't think I have seen it on CM... you have a few pics?

You are correct, that was my first project -- rescued it in 1999 -- rewired, replumbed, repainted, repowered, etc and splashed it in 2001 with a filled in transom and bracket.  Unfortunately I did not know CM existed (don't know if it was up and running then) and wasn't able to learn from all the experts, if I had I would have paid much closer attention to the original transom and done the glass work differently.  Long story short -- last summer 06 had to pull the bracket off and do an entire transom rebuild from the inside.  Used coosa board as the core material, beefed up the transom with some knees, tied it all in structurally to the floor/sole and got her back in the water three months later.  I've done a lot of different work, but last summer was by far the worst job I've ever undertaken.  Cutting, digging, grinding, glassing, grinding, glassing, grinding, sanding, painting, and more sanding and painting June thru Aug in the heat and humidity of a NC summer outside at the boat yard is absolutely no fun!

On CM I've got a few posts username --  MJB or you can search 285.  Here's a before and after to save you the trouble.
Before in 1999:

After Sep 2006:


As for the 170 and the "puddles of stuff", my kids thought it looked like something else........so far neither are too impressed with my project, they don't quite see the diamond in the rough.  But I have know doubt by next spring they'll think differently.

[LilRichard]

NICE 285!  Man, do you have any "working" pictures as you restored?  Did you spray the hull with Imron?  

I am soooo sympathetic to your summer of suffering.  Seeing as I had to re-string my boat, I did more grinding in this lifetime than I ever could want to do.  I think I will stick to smaller refurb projects in the future!

 

[MJB]

New transom went in over Columbus Day weekend, I'll try to get some pics up this week.  

But I have a question about the console/deck I cut out -- I had planned on cutting out the fuel tank coffin and reusing it in a new deck, but after looking over the old deck I'm wondering if I could just reuse the whole deck & coffin??  
I was considering cutting, chipping, grinding out the marine plywood from the backside and leaving the topside, then glass in new marine plywood.  Once done, placing the deck back in place.  
Would this just be a ridiculus amount of work and easier to go with a whole new deck??  I hate to toss the old deck when it seems like I could reuse.  
My biggest concern would be the adhesion of the marine plywood to the old deck glass, but with some buttery resin and mat seems like it might work.
Any thoughts??

[jdupree]

Mike,

I just re-cored the gas tank hatch on my CCP several months ago.  It is a very delicate and time consuming job.  It was very hard removing the wood from the shell without breaking her but I did it.  Mine came out great but now I am noticing "spider webb" cracks are starting to show up on the original skin :evil: I hate that because the skin(non-skid) looked great after the re-core.  Still looks good but has the "spider webbing" going on.

If it were me, since you plan to replace the deck anyway, I would just replace the hatch.  The only reason that I re-cored mine was the rest of my deck was in good shape and I wanted to keep the original non-skid over the tank.

[MJB]

jdupree,

What I would do is re-core the deck keeping the old outer skin as well as the re-core the gas tank cover -- not just the tank cover.

Just seems like a waste to trash the entire deck and toss it all out.  This may be a lot more work than it is worth.  

Thoughts??

[jdupree]

Mike,

Based on how long it takes just to do the hatch, I don't think it would be worth doing.  The outer skin is very old,  and even if you re-core it you might wind up with it "spider webbing" and/or stress cracking anyway.

[LilRichard]

Let me make sure I understand... are you talking about the coffin cover, or the entire deck?  

If it's just the cover, you might recore it... but if it's the entire deck, I agree with Jdupree for sure.  I would build a new deck and hatch... I am in the process now and it is not that crazy... just takes some fairing work to get it right.

[MJB]

jdupree/LilRichard,

You guys are right -- I hadn't thought about the old glass and old cracks/new cracks forming.  I'm going to go with new deck!!

Now to the update.  Sorry I didn't take any pics laminating the two sheets, but here's the final product already cut, fitted, laminated, and ready to go.  I used 2 layers of 1808 between two pieces of 1088 marine ply.



Ready to begin the process, all material cut and ready, resin pre-measured waiting for hardener, resin/filler mixed and ready waiting for hardener.



Used the resin/filler and put a layer all around the inside, added 1.5oz mat, and squished the new transom in place.  I used 1" stainless steel screws to hold it in place (removed once the transom had set for a couple days and filled in the holes with resin/filler).  Glassed in 3 layers 1808 on the inside, 1 layer 1808 on the outisde (for now).







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You'll notice I added about 3" to each side of the transom keeping the original 20" transom height.  I wanted to add a bit of height just to possibly cut down on any water splash over the transom since it is a bit low.  I'm pretty happy with the look, not a drastic change but should help.

The weekend I planned this it happened to be in the mid to upper 80s and hardly and breeze, just what I needed.  Grinding and glassing was painful but I wanted to see some progress.

[LilRichard]

That looks REALLY good.  Really good.

I would suggest at least 3 layers of 1808 on the outside.  You might wish to make each layer a little less overlap - it will help with fairing... otherwise you will end up with a big ridge where your original glass meets the new.  Finish with a layer of 1.5oz mat.  Then get the arms ready for some sanding!

 :twisted:

[MJB]

LilRichard,

Concur with the outside.  I plan on at least another 3 layers of 1808 to build up to about 1/4" and probably another layer on the inside of 1808 as well.  Final layer will be 1.5oz mat.  I want to make sure I get good build up and strength over the top of the transom as well.  I'll probably start there and overlap as I go along.