196 Engine Options

[Ng03]

Hi everyone,

I've been enjoying my 196! finished up the build and it's been a great boat surpassing my expectations. The only frustration has been the 1982 Mariner 115. It's all around a pain. I could rebuild the carbs and probably get it pretty healthy, but a 2 stroke will always be a 2 stroke.

A local marina has a "new" Mercury 150 PRO XS 20" they took off for a customer. it's got around 70hrs on it. The customer upgraded to a 225. They're offering me a steal for it...

I'm tempted to go for it because i'm very pleased with how the rest of the boat came out. I'm aware this is on the edge of what the boat can handle but the stars more or less aligned especially given the current outboard shortage.

From what I've read online this motor should work fine for me but I wanted to see if anyone had opinions/suggestions on this?

[RickK]

I looked at your rebuild pics and it looks like you have the normal notched transom on it after rebuild. The hull was rated for a 125hp back then. What did the 125 weigh back then? Did you do anything to change the floor or scupper height or anything to keep water out with a heavier engine?
What does the Merc weigh compared to your existing engine? If it is a hundred lbs, fill sand bags and weigh them to get 100 lbs and set them on the top of the cowl of your existing engine and see how she sits in the water.
Having a larger engine doesn't hinder the hole shot of the boat, it's the coming off plane too fast that can ruin your day. Search for a member BlueAgave - he added a flotation bracket and a 150 on it.

[Ng03]

I looked at your rebuild pics and it looks like you have the normal notched transom on it after rebuild. The hull was rated for a 125hp back then. What did the 125 weigh back then? Did you do anything to change the floor or scupper height or anything to keep water out with a heavier engine?
What does the Merc weigh compared to your existing engine? If it is a hundred lbs, fill sand bags and weigh them to get 100 lbs and set them on the top of the cowl of your existing engine and see how she sits in the water.
Having a larger engine doesn't hinder the hole shot of the boat, it's the coming off plane too fast that can ruin your day. Search for a member BlueAgave - he added a flotation bracket and a 150 on it.

Hi Rick,

Sorry for the late reply and appreciate your help. I passed on that 150 because i'd like to see what I can do to resurrect my 115 mariner still. Research has showed me how valuable the 2 stroke power to weight ratio is. I've since learned I can get a 150 Pro XS on the back although if I were to repower i'm starting to lean towards a suzuki 130 or 140. If I go forward with it I will post an update. Thanks again for your help. 

[boatnamesue]

Not sure Suki weights, but most all 115-140s are same/similar weight.  Yam 115/130 for sure are same weight.  The jump in weight occurs at the 150hp motor by diff of 100lbs. 

[Fish Head]

Almost done with rebuild, pics coming. 1972 19’6 with new 115hp Pro XS CT 20 inch shaft. 365pounds and added a 28 pound hydraulic jack plate. Raised floor one inch and water level is at 1 1/2 inches below floor. Was hoping for better. So far 14 x 23 mercalloy 4 blade spitfire prop at WOT is 4900rpm at 39mph. Need to drop pitch to 19 and will probably reach top rpm range of 6000/6300rpm and top speed(who cares). Totally happy but I am not a speed demon. Like Rick is suggesting early 70’s 19’6 probably can’t handle over 400 pounds with a 20 inch transom. You would be pushing it maybe with a modern day 150hp four stroke. Actually my jack plate helps block waves that want to flow over transom lol. Maybe a new 115hp would fit your needs? Tough because I almost got caught up in the attitude that everything is a race and needed the biggest hp motor I could fit lol. For me 90% of the time I am on the boat the big motor is off and I am trolling with Minn Kota’s fishing. Cheers T

[Ng03]

Almost done with rebuild, pics coming. 1972 19’6 with new 115hp Pro XS CT 20 inch shaft. 365pounds and added a 28 pound hydraulic jack plate. Raised floor one inch and water level is at 1 1/2 inches below floor. Was hoping for better. So far 14 x 23 mercalloy 4 blade spitfire prop at WOT is 4900rpm at 39mph. Need to drop pitch to 19 and will probably reach top rpm range of 6000/6300rpm and top speed(who cares). Totally happy but I am not a speed demon. Like Rick is suggesting early 70’s 19’6 probably can’t handle over 400 pounds with a 20 inch transom. You would be pushing it maybe with a modern day 150hp four stroke. Actually my jack plate helps block waves that want to flow over transom lol. Maybe a new 115hp would fit your needs? Tough because I almost got caught up in the attitude that everything is a race and needed the biggest hp motor I could fit lol. For me 90% of the time I am on the boat the big motor is off and I am trolling with Minn Kota’s fishing. Cheers T

Thank you for the insight here. 40mph is flying for a 19-6 imo. I would never need to see over 30 if I’m being honest. I have a big local dealer here who for some reason seems to end up with 150 XS’ in stock a fair amount. I saw others online pull it off but as I mentioned I started leaning towards a Suzuki 130. I look forward to seeing your pictures. It sounds like a great build.

[Fish Head]

Welcome anytime. Another option is to go with a 3 blade stainless and I am sure I might get to over 50 mph,maybe. But like you said and I agree I really just enjoy cruising around 28-30 mph sipping my coffee and bs-ing with friends  about who is going to out fish who! You can actually have a normal conversation at 30mph with a quiet 4 stroke lol. I chose aluminum because lots of debris to hit and mess up the lower end where I boat and 4 blade because of improved hole shot for tubing. Someday I might want the “Armstrong Advantage” than for sure the 150hp or higher would be a good fit. I think some of the builds you might be referring to that guys made it work where later 70’s and above 19’6 hulls that are built more robust and can handle the weight.I maybe wrong. Cheers

[cryder]

Hi,  I just rebuilt a 1985 196 and after a bunch of pain in the ... with engines I bought a Suzuki 140.  The gear box is 2.59:1 which I knew but did not appreciate the effects of when I bought it.  I like you am perfectly happy at under 30 MPH which I do with a 3 blade 14*19 proper at 43-4500 rpm and using 4 GPH at 25 mph. I did pick up the transom by 5" when I rebuilt it. the scuppers are under water but it doesn't bother me.

[Ng03]

Hi,  I just rebuilt a 1985 196 and after a bunch of pain in the ... with engines I bought a Suzuki 140.  The gear box is 2.59:1 which I knew but did not appreciate the effects of when I bought it.  I like you am perfectly happy at under 30 MPH which I do with a 3 blade 14*19 proper at 43-4500 rpm and using 4 GPH at 25 mph. I did pick up the transom by 5" when I rebuilt it. the scuppers are under water but it doesn't bother me.

Thanks for the response here and sorry I’m a little late getting back to you. That’s neat to hear you went with a 140. That’s the exact package I’m looking at right now for mine. Just got it priced out a couple days ago. Have you tried pushing top speed out of curiosity? And if you were to go back would you still choose the Suzuki? 4gph at 25 sounds pretty decent to me for what I’ve read on the 196 hulls…..

[Ng03]

Hi all,

I put it off for awhile but finally have decided it’s time before I come up on next season. I need a forestroke and would like to max out my power considering I’d be able to run the motor at lower rpms leading to a longer and happier life.

Been doing a lot more research into this and realize the old flat back was rated for 125hp which was a 285lb outboard. A new 115 pro xs is about 350lb while a yamy 115 is about 380 and a 115/140 zuki 400lb.

I wasn’t planning on a bracket or a jack plate, I’ve spent plenty of money and time but if I truly am limited to 285lb that’s a problem.

 Can anyone shed light on how much I can go without changing the deck height, scuppers, jack plate or bracket? Am I truly limited to 285lb or has anyone found otherwise?

Reading I’ve seen people going big hp motors, 140,150 exc… but it’s hard to decipher if a deck has been raised or a bracket has been out on.

In an ideal world I’d love to go with a 140 Suzuki, good fuel consumption, reliability and selfishly the white motor would look nice. Although this sounds pretty un realistic at 410 lb (same weight as 115).

[Nates 86 200]

I have a 86 200  and  I ran a yamaha 115 fourstroke on it and yes the suppers were below the water. I am currently in the middle of rebuilding it so the transom and the floors have been raised.  I love the foustroke and the 115 pushed that hull well but having the scuppers below the water line was a burden  to me especially if you fish alone and throw castnets or dump water to clean the deck after catching bait. Based on my expierence i would say if there is a fourtsroke on a classic its safe to assume the scuppers are below the water  or the floor and transom has been raised.  But thats just my 2 cents

[Ng03]

I have a 86 200  and  I ran a yamaha 115 fourstroke on it and yes the suppers were below the water. I am currently in the middle of rebuilding it so the transom and the floors have been raised.  I love the foustroke and the 115 pushed that hull well but having the scuppers below the water line was a burden  to me especially if you fish alone and throw castnets or dump water to clean the deck after catching bait. Based on my expierence i would say if there is a fourtsroke on a classic its safe to assume the scuppers are below the water  or the floor and transom has been raised.  But thats just my 2 cents

Thanks for the reply. I hear ya. I think I’m looking for an answer that doesn’t exist unfortunately. Might be time to bite the bullet and look into what a transom rebuild might cost.

[Ng03]

Hi everyone,

Been looking into this further and have seen when upgrading to fore stroke power most if not all rebuild a transom and sometimes add a bracket. I began looking into the project and realized I'd be looking into a lot more time along with money. I installed bilge access and a pump last week which was my first look at the transom and stringers. Unfortunately both were rock solid. 0 Soft spots. This made me more reluctant to embark on a transom rebuild.

I brought my boat to a well known Suzuki dealer today for a professional opinion on what I need for forestroke power. Luckily I was able to meet the owner who was a Suzuki and Proline dealer during the 70s and 80s. He believed I would have no problem with a Suzuki 140, (394lb). He acknowledged the scuppers would be below the waterline but figured a flapper style scupper would help the issue. Obviously, I like this answer but am still hesitant based on seeing most forestroke boats with rebuilt transoms.

Anyone have any final opinions on this?

[Tampa Bay Mike]

I think it'll be a good choice. Anything over a 115 will have your scuppers at the waterline so you may as well get the extra power for around the same weight. Like mentioned already the big weight jump happens at the 150s. The zuke 140 is a great motor. I love mine on my 22. Get some ping pong ball scuppers for the back and enjoy it

[Fish Head]

Anything is possible with a careful thought out epoxy/fiberglass repair! Have your Suzuki mounted. Go splash it and see where the existing scuppers sit. If below waterline np, plug and seal them with epoxy/plug/fiberglass. Lots of great vids on YouTube on how to. With new waterline determined figure out where your new scupper hole need to be, for instance at least 1 inch above waterline. New scupper height should fall within the trough up/down dimension. You can always raise the trough bottom surface up to scupper height with a epoxy/ fiberglass fix. You can raise scuppers to the level of your floor if you have to which would be basically sealing up the the drain trough. The 2 lower mounting bolts of engine will now have to be accessed through bilge access with holes drilled through trough. I am nervous about having holes in a boat below waterline, guess you can have plugs ready to go just in case but sounds like a PIA like other members commented about.