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Author Topic: Brad's '84 175 redeck  (Read 1232 times)

January 10, 2020, 10:20:49 PM
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BradC

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Brad's '84 175 redeck
« on: January 10, 2020, 10:20:49 PM »
Howzit all, been mostly lurking for almost a year after picking up my old girl. I've used her most of 2019 out of a marina in Norwalk CT, with a few adventures during that time which I'll share during the course of the build.

The "there is only one small soft patch around the bilge pump access hatch" sales pitch has turned out to be a tad subjective around the adjective "small" ... I should have smelt a rat with the new half-moon shaped caulking at the base of the consol. Ridden hard and put away wet most of her life by the looks of things ... but ... she's mine now, warts and all.

Made the decision last week to give up her spot at the marina for 2020 and tackle the redecking - the entire year is the current timeline although what's revealed once the old deck is removed may impact that. A year for the deck may seem a tad conservative, but I'm a weekly commuter and only back home in NJ on weekends ... and do a fair amount of overseas travel ... and have a wife ... and 3 teenagers ... and an ethusiastic yakker ... so weekends are pretty full without "another project that won't be finished cluttering up the backyard" (a quote from SWMBO)

Have read Lars and Rick's build threads which, along with everyone else's, have been invaluable to visualising what needs to be done ... although calling out right now that I'm a fugly but functional type of guy, whose imagination paints pictures that his abilities can't match.

So ... the first of many questions and feedback requests:
Going to replace the deck  ... probably going to be with Nidacore (I’ve got an understanding of the cons and will try to mitigate before final installation) ... the big question is how thick?
Currently the boat is pretty wet, coming from the scuppers when I’m at the stern (yip, on a diet in parallel with this project) so will be laying the new deck on top of the rim left from the old deck. I may find that the foam is waterlogged, which when replaced, may substantially raise the scupper holes in relation to the water line anyway ... (live in NE, so water is effing cold in December/January)

Would 2” sheets be overkill? Or create an unsafe gunnel height? Suggestions/opinions please.

In the mean time, the weird warm weather we've been having here in the NE prompted an early start to dismantling ... so we're off ...

Some photos showing the challenge, chips in the gel coat, rats nest in the console etc























January 11, 2020, 05:41:50 AM
Reply #1

mshugg

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Re: Brad's '84 175 redeck
« Reply #1 on: January 11, 2020, 05:41:50 AM »
Two” NidaCore would certainly raise your deck, but it would be more difficult to work with.  It would make matching angles far more critical and likely result in bigger fillets.  A better solution IMO would be to use 1/2 -3/4” NidaCore and build your stringers up to gain the additional height.

As for how much to raise the deck, I’m sure others who have actually raised the deck on a 170 will report their results.  I will say that I always liked the depth of the 170 as it was.  I will say I took mine off shore a lot, probably more than is wise in a 17 footer, so I like to be in rather than on a boat. 

January 11, 2020, 07:35:03 AM
Reply #2

RickK

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Re: Brad's '84 175 redeck
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2020, 07:35:03 AM »
Brad - I fixed all your pics (Edit Photo/Rotate CW/Submit changes). When you take pics with your phone hold the phone horizontal with the lens to the left.  Then they'll display correctly without editing them.

Now about the 2" Nida. I respect what mshugg posted, he's quite the craftsman and I would like to open this up to everyone (I'll ping some of our other Master Rebuilders too). When Brad asked me prior to posting here I explained that I had used 1/2" with 2 lams of 1708 on each side BUT then I started thinking about the 2" and assuming good craftsmanship, I couldn't think of one bad reason to using it with the exception of longer screws/bolts for connections. There is a plus I think in that you have more depth to get creative in design, like making recessed drains. I thought of being able to drill your scupper holes 1" lower than the floor height and creating a "cup" that water drains from floor into and then out the lower scupper. Also, making hatch/gutter pairs and actually having depth to build in drains to empty the gutters toward the scuppers without having to figure out a way to do this under the floor. That is only two examples - I'm sure others can easily be thought of.  The downsides to honeycomb in general is that all the strength comes from what is laminated on it, once you break the laminations, the honeycomb is weak, so you have to plan on how you'll beef that up, like with thickened resin, adding PVC, maybe carbon, etc.
Let's discuss this some more so we can give Brad every possible option and we can all learn something too.
Rick
1971 "170" with 115 Johnson (Rebuilding it now)

1992 230 Explorer with 250 Yamaha

January 11, 2020, 10:43:16 PM
Reply #3

Capt. Bob

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Re: Brad's '84 175 redeck
« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2020, 10:43:16 PM »
I'm gonna guess that 2, 1/2" sheets of Nida is cheaper than a 2" sheet so...

Take that cost savings and invest in a below deck alum or poly tank. :ScrChin:

Good luck.
]
Capt. Bob
1991 210 Walkaround
2018 Yamaha 150 4 Stroke
"Reef or Madness IV"

January 12, 2020, 08:53:51 AM
Reply #4

BradC

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Re: Brad's '84 175 redeck
« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2020, 08:53:51 AM »
Thanks guys, on reflection there appears to be little benefit to using thicker boards, as the structural strength comes from the glass coatings not the honeycomb ... thanks for for bringing clarity to what is actually obvious. Going with 1/2" and will build up the stringers.

Next question ... stringer ... what is the best material for building up stringers with the following goal in mind (I'm considering embedding a thin layer of metal on top of whatever the buildup layer is so a detector of sorts can easily indicate where the stringer is ... yes/no/over thinking?). To mount something post build on top of  the stringers, one would over drill a hole into the deck as far as the bottom glass layer, hollow out a surrounding inch or 2 of the honeycomb, fill with epoxy and drill as per usual .... going deeper into the stringer buildup layer will then add further "bite" to the screw for an additional 1" or so .... so the buildup material should then be fairly dense ... suggestions? Or overthinking?

Thanks guys, you've already helped avert a costly and needless path (and probably future frustration) ... have your next cooling beverage on me  :singing:

January 12, 2020, 11:06:47 AM
Reply #5

BradC

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Re: Brad's '84 175 redeck
« Reply #5 on: January 12, 2020, 11:06:47 AM »
More tips from the brain trust please: Steering wheel is the last piece remaining on the console ... got the nut off but the wheel itself is being stubborn. Does it just slip onto the threaded bolt or does it also screw down? See pic below (liquid is PB Blaster in an attempt to loosen up a touch) . What is the most efficient approach? Thanks guys



January 12, 2020, 11:46:32 AM
Reply #6

BradC

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Re: Brad's '84 175 redeck
« Reply #6 on: January 12, 2020, 11:46:32 AM »
This is the half moon I referred to earlier.  ::o:


January 12, 2020, 07:17:48 PM
Reply #7

mshugg

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Re: Brad's '84 175 redeck
« Reply #7 on: January 12, 2020, 07:17:48 PM »
The steering wheel is on a tapered shaft, so basically it’s suck like **** until it isn’t.  You may be able to borrow a wheel pulling tool from an auto parts store.  Or you may be able to improvise one.  You want something that pulls up on the steering wheel while pushing down on the shaft.

As for building up the stringers, it’s a good use for scrap.  I used scrap carbon core (same as Coosa) from my transom, but hair scrap deck material will work too.  It’s the glass over the core that gives it strength.  Some builders use PVC fence posts to build up height.  Again, it’s the glass that makes it strong.

January 13, 2020, 05:51:03 AM
Reply #8

RickK

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Re: Brad's '84 175 redeck
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2020, 05:51:03 AM »
The steering wheel slides down on the shaft and there is a "key" on the shaft to keep the wheel aligned. As mshugg said, find a wheel puller, maybe Harbor Freight?
Rick
1971 "170" with 115 Johnson (Rebuilding it now)

1992 230 Explorer with 250 Yamaha

January 13, 2020, 06:00:22 AM
Reply #9

RickK

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Re: Brad's '84 175 redeck
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2020, 06:00:22 AM »
The best way to know where the stringers and bulkheads are is to make a detailed drawing of the inside of the hull from the same place always, like the starboard side. Measure and note each side of the stringer, top and bottom. Another thing to do is measure the top of the stringers from a 1x2 or similar laid across the top of the gunwale. The more you document the build/boat on paper, the more beneficial it'll be later when you need to know where something is. Another thing to document is where you install reinforcements, like for the console or  t-top. So yeah, laying metal to find the stringer might be a little overkill ;-)
Rick
1971 "170" with 115 Johnson (Rebuilding it now)

1992 230 Explorer with 250 Yamaha

January 13, 2020, 07:23:45 AM
Reply #10

Capt. Bob

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Re: Brad's '84 175 redeck
« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2020, 07:23:45 AM »
More tips from the brain trust please: Steering wheel is the last piece remaining on the console ... got the nut off but the wheel itself is being stubborn. Does it just slip onto the threaded bolt or does it also screw down? See pic below (liquid is PB Blaster in an attempt to loosen up a touch) . What is the most efficient approach? Thanks guys

Light reading.
https://classicaquasport.com/smf/index.php?topic=6994.0

]
Capt. Bob
1991 210 Walkaround
2018 Yamaha 150 4 Stroke
"Reef or Madness IV"

January 13, 2020, 08:46:55 AM
Reply #11

CTsalt12

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Re: Brad's '84 175 redeck
« Reply #11 on: January 13, 2020, 08:46:55 AM »
Brad-One thought.  Coming from a non experienced rebuilder, but someone whose spent a lot of time on these 170/175s.

When you replace the deck, you may want to change the angle of the deck.  A lot of guys simply raise the deck to solve the 'water coming in the scuppers' issue.  When you're on a modern really nice boat like a Grady of this size, same layout, you can see the deck is a good bit higher in the bow, and angled down gradually towards the stern.  Promotes better drainage.  It's annoying when on these boats if you've got one or 2 people in the bow area at times, because that's where the most space is, the water has a tendency to hang in the front of the boat fore of the console, and won't drain till your underway. 

An angled deck may help this.  Just an idea.

Jimbo
1989 175 Osprey

January 13, 2020, 10:43:21 AM
Reply #12

RickK

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Re: Brad's '84 175 redeck
« Reply #12 on: January 13, 2020, 10:43:21 AM »
Good idea CT.
Rick
1971 "170" with 115 Johnson (Rebuilding it now)

1992 230 Explorer with 250 Yamaha

January 13, 2020, 09:20:51 PM
Reply #13

BradC

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Re: Brad's '84 175 redeck
« Reply #13 on: January 13, 2020, 09:20:51 PM »
Brad-One thought.  Coming from a non experienced rebuilder, but someone whose spent a lot of time on these 170/175s.

When you replace the deck, you may want to change the angle of the deck.  A lot of guys simply raise the deck to solve the 'water coming in the scuppers' issue.  When you're on a modern really nice boat like a Grady of this size, same layout, you can see the deck is a good bit higher in the bow, and angled down gradually towards the stern.  Promotes better drainage.  It's annoying when on these boats if you've got one or 2 people in the bow area at times, because that's where the most space is, the water has a tendency to hang in the front of the boat fore of the console, and won't drain till your underway. 

An angled deck may help this.  Just an idea.

That is a good call, just build up the stringers a bit more on the bow side, nice CT, tx

January 13, 2020, 09:23:22 PM
Reply #14

BradC

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Re: Brad's '84 175 redeck
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2020, 09:23:22 PM »

Light reading.
https://classicaquasport.com/smf/index.php?topic=6994.0


Hadn't considered a key slot, will check on the weekend if the weather permits, tx.