Ferguson response

[gran398]

Bob....part of liberalism is accommodating all thoughts/ideas/takes and twists. My comments on the diamond market was this specific market only, not intended to illustrate other abundances, although as you note they certainly do exist.  if John recommends this book for numerous reasons...we should read it with an open mind to alternative and equally interesting viewpoints.

[seabob4]

Bob....part of liberalism is accommodating all thoughts/ideas/takes and twists. My comments on the diamond market was this specific market only, not intended to illustrate other abundances, although as you illustrate they certainly do exist.  if John recommends this book for numerous reasons...we should read it with an open mind to alternative and equally interesting viewpoints.

As opposed to conservatism?

[seabob4]

I did some research on "Abundance"...no offense, anyone, but "feel good" techno-names and a few isolated instances of individuals making things better is NOT going to convince me that mankind can survive it's own destiny.  If I may ask, where in this book is the concept of greed addressed?  Or are you guys gonna make me read it?

[seabob4]

From a Greek phillosopher...

"Nothing is enough for the man to whom enough is too little."

Look around you, how many people in your life, in the news, in this world, exhibit that same behavior?  Eliminate this behavior...you have abundance, no fancy names attached...

[gran398]

Exactly the same on equally opposite fronts SB. Both views at the extreme tolerate no thinking other than their own.

We began by discussing rioting, arson, mahem, pillage, looting, and destruction of private and communal (government) property. Recognizing that greed plays a huge part in humanity....whether taking advantage of the masses via corporate manipulation or something as simple as stealing a flatscreen on Thanksgiving eve.....

Let's look at the consequences of individual greed in different parts of the world.

In the USA...in a riot....if you hold your bandana/facemask close to your nose, you may get a whiff of tear gas as a consequence of greed as you carry off your newly-stolen flatscreen.

However...if you live in Fallujah, Iraq....home of the new black flag ....if personal greed involves smoking a cigarette...you'll have both hands chopped off. Tough to light a cigarette with no hands.

I'm sick and tired of people crying while living in our country. And worse still, crying while sucking off  the working man.

We have a huge problem with illegal immigration. And God Bless them, they are trying with all their worth to get here. Every penny of savings, just to cross the border....looking for a better life. But unless they are coming for a reason other than a significantly better life.... we wouldn't be dealing with them and our taxpayer burden...right?

Want to see real poverty? Travel abroad.

This country knows zero poverty compared to the rest of the world.

[seabob4]

Thus, given that we see things "bad" here, yet by your description, this country has it VERY good in comparison to the rest of the world, how would the "concepts" the authors of this book be implemented?  What would a hedge fund manager do with these concepts?  Spit on them, as they wouldn't further his ideals to have the most..  What would a street urchin on the garbage piles of New Delhi do with these concepts?  Light the book on fire to cook a rat over, for tonight's dinner.  There, 2 different extremes of the world we live in, both having no use for utopian concepts which, from what I can tell, are exactly that...

[seabob4]

Well, I'll be damned...http://singularity-utopia.blogspot.com/ ... uture.html

[gran398]

Bob, I get it. And nope...the USA isn't the world's savior. And don't believe in spending our hard-earned tax dollars studying the chirping spotted frog in the rainforests of Indonesia.

Let's be thankful for what  we have. Damn ISIS and the rest who have designs upon our country.  

Nice lively discussion tonight. Newbies...Bob and I are buds. Just a couple of graybeards matching points over a beer. Bob will agree.

Happy Thanksgiving everyone. And may God Bless the USA

[seabob4]

Correct, my Bro, on all accounts.  I guess chat was here tonight!!

Bless all, bless your loved ones, be thankful every day you're on this earth, and give thanks to the ones who are no longer with us, yet still affect us every day.

Enjoy tomorrow!!!

[futch13]

Damn!!!  I missed the chat  :(  :(  Hope every one has a safe and Happy Thanksgiving  

[flycaster1]

Makes me scratch my head like I just woke up and ask myself "where am I?"

[GoneFission]

Bob - the book is not about luxury items like jewelry.  It's more about worldwide access to water, food, energy, education, healthcare, and freedom.  The book describes the last 200 or so years of history and how the next 30-50 years might address these challenges.  

Don't blow it off casually - Read the book - then decide if you agree or disagree.

[MarshMarlowe196]

This article has been making the rounds lately.  It's a bit long winded, but the article addresses every aspect of this situation in Ferguson, and I couldn't agree with it more than I do.  Worth the read.

http://www.theblaze.com/contributions/h ... d-justice/

[gran398]

This article has been making the rounds lately.  It's a bit long winded, but the article addresses every aspect of this situation in Ferguson, and I couldn't agree with it more than I do.  Worth the read.

http://www.theblaze.com/contributions/h ... d-justice/

Jesse, that was spot-on, every word.

Thanks for the post.

[seabob4]

Excellent read, Jessie, excellent read...

John, I was not comparing luxury to necessities, I was simply using diamonds as an example of abundance vs who controls said abundance.  I thought it was interesting that in many articles, Abundance was walking step-in-step with post-scarcity economics, which basically states that when there is no scarcity of any given commodity, said commodity will either be free, or will cost next to nothing, as all said commodities are in abundance...huh?  This type of un-selfish behavior is virtually unknown to mankind, from the onset of civilizations , through today, and far into the future...man, is by nature, a very selfish creature.  

Let's look at water.  When the earliest settlers of our west bought up land, they also considered the water on that land theirs...water rights.  There was an abundance of water on their land...but it belonged to them.  Do you want some?  Certainly, I'll let you have some...for a price.  That is the very nature of man's behavior.  Especially when it concerns commodities we need.  Any person who has the good fortune to come into an abundance of a necessity will automatically attach a price to that commodity, as they know people can't do without it.  It's been going on since the dawn of mankind.

It will take a MAJOR behavioral shift in human behavior to create a type of society envisioned in post-scarcity economics.  Since the behavior I just described has been going on ad infinitum, and, in reality, is getting worse, I seriously doubt this type of change is going to occur...