Recirculating Livewell Pump

[Capt. Bob]

First Wes, I realize you're deep into this at this stage but I think you would be happier if you could separate the two plumbing systems.

Looking at your plumbing schematic, can you replace the Y fitting with something like this?
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/st ... _sku=91962

Whatever brand valve you choose and place of purchase isn't important. What is, is that you now have separated the systems so they don't act against themselves. Set the valve position to allow use of your main pump/fill/clam shell.  Re-set to isolate that feed and open the drain/pump/oxygenator/recirc. Be sure to place that pump (recirc) in an upright position for max efficiency.

Yes the valve is somewhat costly but if this was mine, that's how I'd plumb it. I personally feel you will realize much better performance from both pumping systems when plumbed in this manner.

Edit: Again, should you choose this route, you may already realize this point but it bears repeating. The Y valve needs to be plumbed correctly in order to get a positive function. They are designed (?) to be one intake and two discharge. I'm not sure that they can discharge both at once but that's not what you're trying to achieve. You want the "intake" to be plumbed to your tank and the two discharges plumbed to each pump accordingly. I've never used one so I'm just trying to describe the theory.

Good luck.

[wessnapp]

THANK YOU DAN & CAPT BOB.

If the pump starts working when the seacock is opened, that means there is too much initial pressure for the pump to push water when it is closed at the get go. Once the pump is pushing water and the seacock is closed again, the pump continues to work as it has the flow established. When trailering the boat, the water sloshing around could create a back pressure into the manifold thus killing the flow and the motor just buzzing.

I am thinking that a Y-Connector will be the key.  The flow is restricted greatly when directly hitting a T connector.  Anyone know where to pick up a 1 1/8" y connector?  

I'm going to screw with it all weekend and see how it handles in different conditions.  

THE BOTTOM LINE:
The plumbing all needs to be totally re-done.  The recirc needs to be on it's own loop, not "jerry rigged" into an existing system.  But, this will have to wait until the winter when there is no live bait to use.  Damn.

[gran398]

Makes good sense, you'll have a direct, clean flow with either system.

[wessnapp]

Just got off the phone with Rule.  The first question they asked was: dose the hose have a dip between the livewell and the pump.  If the hose dips below the pump and then comes back up, because the pump is centrifugal, it will not perform well.  This coupled with being fed through a t-connector, the pump will experience cavitation.  

Further, if I am feeding it through another t-connector, any disruption in the water flow will again create cavitation.   To make this work well, I need to replace  both t-connectors with y-connectors, secure the end of day drain hose to the under part of the deck until it reaches the pump, and finally I need to get the pump turned up rather than on it's side.  FML

EDIT:  Called local company "Keep Alive" and they said the pump being sideways is an absolute NO NO.  The air the pump is pulling in will slowly build up in the pump and create cavitation.  Keep Alive said that is without question the main culprit.  Everything else is fine.

-a temp fix & bridge until the winter.

[Capt. Bob]

The things we humans do to keep little critters alive so as to feed them to big critters and then we...

End up feeding on them ourselves

Ain't life grand.

[dburr]

When trailering the boat, the water sloshing around could create a back pressure into the manifold thus killing the flow and the motor just buzzing.

The pump is in the bilge so we know you have good suction head...    

The MFG said is a must to mount the pump vertical to prevent issues with the getting air bound.  Makes sense if the little air inducer is at the eye of the pump.  I was thinking it was on the outflow in a venturi so didn't consider that as an issue, my apologies.  

If you fix the pump mounting position before you do/change anything else you may find that life is again good..  Hopefully you can just loosen a clamp or two and yard the thing vertical to test the theroy, keep it simple first, if that doesn't work then get out the hammer...


As a standing member of the "not very guardedly skeptics club"..  I don't by "a dip in the suction line" to be much of a causal factor because the pump is BELOW its suction source..  Does the trap in your sink ever get air bound  

[RickK]

I'm not a plumber  

[seabob4]

Personally, I don't really buy Rules explanations as the fix for all problems...but, knowing Wes' boat like I do, and the effed up job that the outfit that installed the recirc pump did in the first place, he has kind of a ...perfect storm in regards to chit not working...

[gran398]

When trailering the boat, the water sloshing around could create a back pressure into the manifold thus killing the flow and the motor just buzzing.

The pump is in the bilge so we know you have good suction head...    

The MFG said is a must to mount the pump vertical to prevent issues with the getting air bound.  Makes sense if the little air inducer is at the eye of the pump.  I was thinking it was on the outflow in a venturi so didn't consider that as an issue, my apologies.  

If you fix the pump mounting position before you do/change anything else you may find that life is again good..  Hopefully you can just loosen a clamp or two and yard the thing vertical to test the theroy, keep it simple first, if that doesn't work then get out the hammer...


As a standing member of the "not very guardedly skeptics club"..  I don't by "a dip in the suction line" to be much of a causal factor because the pump is BELOW its suction source..  Does the trap in your sink ever get air bound  

Good post db.

 Bottom line, the existing pump either works or it doesn't. The good news with a diaphragm pump vs. the centrifugal pump shown...washdown/livewell (diaphragm) pumps are advertised and guaranteed to suck water, air and froth to a 12 foot head and continually self-prime, no problem, and can run dry (sucking air)  without damage at a 6 amp draw all day long 'till the batts die Make that a quarter day long. They'll drain a batt in the blink of an eye.

I'm with Captain Bob's solution. Spend 42 bucks, separate the systems, get'r done, and go fish.