1985 196 Rebuild

[cryder]

Next up is the gunwale guard replacement.  The old stuff looked OK but I wanted to do this to improve the look of the boat and I fond it on sale at Hamilton Marine.  I removed the old stuff and noted that some of the screws holding the deck to the hull were loose or had "ovaled out" the holes all together.  First I used #12 broad head screws and added these to holes where the old gunwale was fastened through the hull and deck.  The new gunwale is taller so it would only "catch" the hull.  I then removed the old deck to hull screws and replaced those with the same #12 broads. These were about 10 per 100 from Jamestown.  I then watched a video on installing a new gunwale that said to heat the product first.  I've done this job a few times without this step but thought it sounded like a good idea.  BTW, the gunwale was, is,  Barbour Plastics Part Number: DWP-92162-FB.  Here's the lesson.  Warm is good but be careful not to stretch it too much as I did.  Laid it in the sun on a nice hot day. Fastened it at the bow with the same #12 broad heads and then stretched it at the stern and had someone fasten it there.  The issue is something called poisson's ratio which being an engineer I should have been more aware of. As you stretch something one way it get's narrower in the perpendicular direction.  Think stretching out taffee. I had a hell of a time getting the white insert into the narrowed gap for same.  I ended using a pair of lock grip used in welding that look like a hammer head and a heat gun and some soap.  Heat 12". squish 3" flat and push it in.  On the plus side it was so hot than when it, the gunwale not the insert, cooled it pulled in VERY tight to the hull and it looks great.  This job was well worth the $200 or so of material.  BTW, I used the recommended way to add pics last time and it was cumbersome to say the least.

[Capt. Bob]

 

[cryder]

OK, I'm gonna add this hear and perhaps it should go someplace else too but I had a 2001 Honda 130 on this boat with a 4 blade 13.25x15 prop that maxed out at about about 5400 RPM.  I used this about 4 times before the rot in the exhaust port killed that engine. I am guessing it went 35 or so with this. But now I just bought a 2021 Suzuki DF140A and with a 4 blade 13*19 it turns 5400+ (still over propped I know) but is much slower as the Suzuki has a 2.59:1 gear box where as the Honda (and old Mercs and a Yamaha F150) have a 2:1 gear box.  The BIG (and I mean HUGE difference here is that the Honda or Merc or Yamaha at 4000 RPM's turn the prop at 2000 RPM.  The Suzuki needs to turn 5180 RPMS at the power head to get 2000 rpms at the prop.  So planing speed with a Yamaha may be  4000 RPM but with the Suzuki it will be nearly 5200.  I have an excel spread sheet that goes over this math.  The Suzuki is lighter BUT if you have a light boat like an aquasport you don't need to worry about working the engine too hard to get up onto a plane.  In theory the suzuki turns a bigger prop but slower and I must be honest, IMHO, the old Honda had a better hole shot and planed the boat at a lower RPM.

[cryder]

BTW the paint is working very well a year later BUT the white deck was a mistake.  It just shows every spec of dirt and I plan on buying a gallon of black to make up some grey and painting the decks grey now  that I have the engine sorted out.

[aquaman998]

Hi, I am replacing my tank as well. I see the description of how you pilled new fuels lines. Do you have any pictures besides these? I am trying to figure out where to drill holes to get the new filler and lines up to the fill hole and vent hole. Any info would be excellent. I was thinking I can run the vent line through the existing filler tube and use it as a conduit and run the filler tube where the vent line used to be as it seems to have some play.

[dbiscayne]

Have you tried a different prop on the Suzuki to make up for the gear reduction? I've seen a lot of Suzuki's use a larger diameter prop, not just pitch change, to best push the boat.

[cryder]

Hi, I am replacing my tank as well. I see the description of how you pilled new fuels lines. Do you have any pictures besides these? I am trying to figure out where to drill holes to get the new filler and lines up to the fill hole and vent hole. Any info would be excellent. I was thinking I can run the vent line through the existing filler tube and use it as a conduit and run the filler tube where the vent line used to be as it seems to have some play.

  Hi, I finally gave up on trying to dig through the foam to get the new fuel fill line in.  I used a hole saw to make a new hole to the port of the existing one and I ran it forward below the deck past the end of the fore-aft structure and then up to the fuel fill deck plate.  It does 'flop around' a bit so I spared some foam around it in a few places to hold it. Messy job under the deck. Not optimal but done and after 2 years all OK. I did run the vent line through the abandoned old fuel fill line as you mention.  Lesson learned on that one is don't forget the high loop on the vent line like this dummy did.  I got water in the tank and had to splice in a few feet of hose to make a high loop.  Fortunatly I added a fuel water separator so no harm.  And I added a clam shell over the new vent on the outside to divert water just for good measure.  Another mistake (common as it turns out apparently) is I ran all new wires but what I should have done is run a conduit through the fuel tank coffin area and then run the wires through that. duhh. Not an issue yet but at some point in time I will wish I had a pull string through there.  Hope this helps and good luck.  The more I use my 196 the more I love it.  Perfect sized boat.

[cryder]

Have you tried a different prop on the Suzuki to make up for the gear reduction? I've seen a lot of Suzuki's use a larger diameter prop, not just pitch change, to best push the boat.

  I really should go back and change all my gripes about the prop and lack of speed.  Here's the story. I now trailer the boat and I noticed a few months ago the bow eye coming loose with the use.  The one thing i did not do but OK NBD. I pulled out the floor to the rope locker to find about 200 lbs of store bought lead ingot in there, glassed carefully in place, which I removed with great effort and replaced the wood block behind the bow eye. When I bought the boat it had been flat backed but the seller took the mount off for the sale. He said the boat never seemed to 'ride right' with a 175 2 stroke on it and having had that problem in a previous boat I decided that when I rebuilt the transom I would NOT flat back it, but I did raise the mount height by 5".  The lead was all store bought so I assume that the original rich Marblehead guy who owned it and paid someone to flat back it for him found out the boat was now out of balance with an engine on a bracket and paid someone to add the lead to get the bow down.  Point being is that now that I 'got the lead out' the boat rides great.  I ended up with a Suzuki 3x14x18 SS prop which is a tad under propped but I have tons of power at all RPM's and the boat planes very comfortably at about 4200 RPM with a full load of gas and 2 adults.  Since I really don't like how the boat handles when going fast, and it is after all a 35+ year old hull I'm careful with the old girl, this is just fine with me.

[Dribs]

Cryder I am about to install a pie plate for bilge access similar to the hole you have drilled on yours.  Do you have the dimensions from the transom to the edge of the hole you drilled?

[Dribs]

Also what size deck plate did you install?

[cryder]

Hi,  I did not add that access plate as it was there when I bought the boat so I just replaced the 8" nominal size access port and I don't keep the boat at my house so I can not measure it but I do KNOW that in my 1985 196 model there is nothing to 'hit' or 'miss' under the floor aft of the tank coffin.  Come to think of it mine have a (I think) factory mounting platform (flat spot) for the bilge pump.  Looks to be about 12" clear from this picture.  One trick I did which worked well.  I put a screw into the center of the access hatch and used it to hold a zip tie holding the wire connections for the bilge pump up out of the water

[cryder]

HI All,  It's been 2 years and so I decided to do an update and let all know how things are holding up and where I made mistakes.  First, I love this boat.  It's the medium bear. I can tow with a non-monster truck, launch and retrieve it by myself and with the Sukuki 140 and a smallish 18P prop it jumps up on plane and stays there at 4200 RPM.

What went right:
-The console is still crack free, solid and holding to the deck with no problem.
-The fuel tank is great but I did fail, at first, to high lop the vent line so I got water in the tank.  Good thing I put in a fuel water separator.
-The gunnel guard is great.
-The paint is holding up FANTASTIC.  Glossy, hard and no chips.
-The epoxy injected into the deck made it solid BUT I failed to remember a fundamental truth-epoxy is harder than polyester resin. Even though I scraped and sanded these I ended up with the 'nubs' of the epoxy visible, not too bad but I notice it when one looks at the deck.
-The transom is holding up really well.  It's solid with no concerning cracks and I used plywood BUT see below.
-I striped the bottom paint, then barrier coated it and painted it and this made a huge difference to how the boat looks.
-I bought a hand rail for the console on FB marketplace which allowed me to use the windshield which again made the boat look totally different and with the console so solid the hand rail is solid.
-I bought an 8’ long bimini, again FB marketplace, and it is a must here in south florida.  I added a few solid struts to the back and I have heavy bungy chord from the console rail to the corner for when I’m in chop.
-The lewmar bow roller and short shank anchor provides plenty of holding power.  I bought a 6’ section of SS chain and covered it with nylon chaif guard.  Looks good, works great.
-I bought a full engine cover for when it’s on the trailer.  Best $100 you can spend to protect a new engine investment.
-I love the old school analogue gauges.  I tried the single digital and it looked plain.
-I love the $130? Boss radio I bought (with 2 speakers) which Bluetooth connects to my phone.  It’s perfect.  It did get moisture in it inside of week but it still works.
-I love the Edson steering knob. I tried a lewmar and it was junk.  I tried an Amazon special and it was too small.  The Edson is expensive but it’s worth it.
-I love the simplicity of the old school morse steering cable and my 100 lb 17 year old daughter can turn the wheel.
-The leaning post I bought off FB marketplace too and I should have spent a few bucks more to get one with a better fit n finish.  This was cheap and I guess it looks OK.  I fasted this to the deck just like the console setting it a bed of 5200 and screwing it down.


What went not so well:
-Messing around with two, yes two, old engines.  If your wife will allow it.  After you spend all this time and money on a boat go buy an engine.  My wife eventually told me it was OK.
-The deck color. The white shows every spec of dirt.  I should have bought some black and mixed up grey for the deck.  I will do this over the winter.
-There are cracks in the transom in the filler.  I used epoxy to glass in the transom and that made it strong BUT I had to build it out to get something close to flat.  I was running out of steam at this point and just used way too much, too thick, fairing style filler.  Some day I may tackle making this pretty but I sort of doubt it.  I now enjoy using the boat instead of working on it.
-I bought a Taylor made cover for the boat for like $400.  I love that it keeps the boat clean on the trailer between uses but wish I had just spent a bit more on a sunbrella version.  2 years later and this thing is dead and yes I submitted a warranty claim but it's a prorated value.
-In hindsight I should have done more sanding for the paint OR sprayed it.  It looks OK for the time I had to do the project but could have been better and now that everything is mounted fixing that is doubtful.  I was planning to buff the paint but I have not as of yet for fear of it looking worse where it now looks OK.
-I personally like the SS hand rail in the front BUT I should not have put the mid ship cleats back on.  I never need a spring line and they get in the way of going over the side.
-The bow roller can be tricky to get into the roller but IMO it’s still better that having to stow the anchor in a hatch between uses which was something I wanted from the beginning.  This was one few thing about my old 170 I could not stand.

All in all as they say I’m very happy with the mix of what my time and money allowed for.  A buddy of mine bought a 15’ whaler right after I did this project and 2 years later he’s still working on it while I get to use my boat.

[RickK]

Looks good - congrats on the outcome.

[Fish Head]

Looks good! Not everyone perseveres and finishes the “Project”. Enjoy 😉

[Capt. Bob]

Nice!
Thanks for sharing and enjoy.