Classic AquaSport
Aquasport Model Rebuilds, Mods, Updates and Refreshes => Osprey Style Hull Rebuilds => 22-2 Rebuilds => Topic started by: h20ryder on June 12, 2012, 12:21:54 PM
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Hello everyone.
New to posting on this forum but have been on here for a few months reading and searching other owners builds. Really has helped me a lot! (and ClassicMako another great site).
Bought this boat a few months back and previous owner and DMV say its a 1999 "SeaFlite" although after searching for weeks finally found a few random pics of an Aquasport 222 and knew that had to be what this is.
Transom was such a basket case and hack job that I can't pull the HIN off clearly to identify year. Can anyone help just based on pics?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/IMG_0908.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5127&title=boat&cat=500)
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Based on the photo and the air ducts on the cap, I'd guess the year to be '73, '74, or a '75.
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Correct on the year range Fern.
Not the original console.
Is it possible to blacken-up the hull ID #'s on the transom?
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Thanks for the input. HIN on transom has been repaired from about 14 inches down all the way up to the cap.
Fiberglass paint stripper pulled most of the 3 different paints/gelcoats off and shows 2 different sets of numbers but there is a repair seam running through both so it is all jumbled.
If I can pinpoint it will DMV correct the title?
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All you need are the last 3 digits. If it is one of those years then it would have 2 numbers and then a letter. As is in mine: 83G, October of 1983.
Registering it might be a problem anywhere without the complete number, each state is a little different and until you check you won't know how many hoops you have to jump through! It could end up getting a homemade number.
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In the early seventies the "G" would represent the month of February.
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Here is the progress on my new transom and stringers.
Transom was built from the inside. Inner skin layup with 1708, ¾ inch ACX plywood, sandwiched 1708, ¾ inch ACX plywood, then 3 layers of 1708. Feels really strong.
Transom was done with West System epoxy but switched to US Composites epoxy for stringers and sole.
Entire floor was grinded and sanded then covered in one layer of 1708 except in the rear where there was a lot of oil canning so I used 2 layers of 1708 and one layer of 24 oz roving.
Stringers are 28 inches apart which was based on the strakes and fitting in my new 65 gallon fuel tank.
Stringers are double ½ inch ACX plywood sandwiched with 2 layers of 6 oz cloth between them. Also screwed with stainless screws at joints. 2x4’s in pics are just holding things square and will be removed and ACX bulkheads installed.
Questions:
I want to wet out the entire stringers with unthickened epoxy in 2 coats. Do I need to sand the first coat before applying the second? Or is it better to let coat 1 get tacky then apply coat 2 wet-on-wet?
Also, should I tab the entire length of the stringers in at one time with the side support “wings” removed or can I tie the “wings” in to the hull at the same time?
Using PL Premium adhesive to bed the stringer system to the hull.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/transom.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5135&title=new-transom-layup&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/hull5.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5125&title=hull-pics&cat=500)
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Most people try to have at least 1 1/2" thick stringers/bulkheads/ribs so they have plenty of material to screw the deck down too... only 1" doesn't leave a lot of support on the joints where your floor pieces will meet, or give you any really solid place to anchor your center console or whatever else you plan to attach to the deck.
Looks like you're off to a really clean start! Based on where the inside "drip edge" of the cap stops I would say you have a 74. depending on the year, i have seen them where they wrap all the way around the interior or stop a little more forward like yours.
Whats your overall plan for the boat?
I only have experience with Poly resin, but I know with that, a wet on wet (just before it kicks) is the best when layering, and anything after 24hrs needs to be sanded to removed the top "film"... I think epoxy is generally the same.
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Thanks love2fish. Oh, so I should have used thicker wood for the stringers? I guess I can pattern another ½ inch ACX board for each side to get the 1.5 inch total thickness pretty easily.
Then I wouldn’t need to add cleats to the bulkheads for attaching the new sole? Just drill a pilot hole and attach straight into the stringer itself and it won’t separate the plywood layers?
Plans for the boat are a new center console that I have already built and glassed in my garage that will hold all electronics and a head. Will add pics soon. I have also modified a 45 gallon baitwell to incorporate a leaning post all as one unit.
I really want a T-Top and the Stryker Tower guys are local so eventually I hope to get one unless a nice used one can be found.
Front casting deck will be modified to a vee shaped seating setup with removable center section so it can still be used as a bed.
This will be a weekend recreation fisher for San Clemente Island/Catalina Island as well as a surf boat for accessing some good waves privately owned by the local military bases that I can’t get land access to.
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What are thoughts on the liners in these boats?
Are they supposed to contact the hull walls?
Or is there supposed to be an air space between the hull and liner to prevent hard spots on the vertical hull walls?
If they touch the hull sides wouldn’t that create chatter?
I have ½ inch plywood spacers between the hull walls and liner right now that will be pulled out after the sole is tabbed and cured. Is this right?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Liner_spacers.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5138&title=liner-to-hull-spacers&cat=500)
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Before you get to much farther along, do a couple of destructive tests on screwing into end grain on plywood. The results will scare you...
Any place you plan on fastening something, put a cleat of a substraght that will REALLY hold a fastener, not end grain..... With all that fine work you are doing it would be a shame not to have it all last. If you mortise out the ply where your landings will be for the console and T top then set cleats in you will be ok. The faying surfaces can be glued up with thickened epoxy.. My own twisted sense of over kill would be a laminate thickness of 4" wide at the top, 3 deep (for good contact) and length as needed of your on hand 1/2 ply immediately below the mortise. Then on top of that if you don't want to spring for G-10 (I totally understand, not sure if I would either) then lam up what you have on hand to get at least 2 inches to fasten into.. You could evan plan to over drill holes, fill with epoxy, then drill and tap for machine screws to keep everything sealed.
There are better ways to do it, this is just one way that would let me sleep at night with no worries :mrgreen:
And fine work!! Great to see such good progress :salut:
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I ended up adding another layer of 1/2 inch ACX to both stringers last night to get the total of 1.5 inch overall thickness per suggestion by love2fish.
I'm all about over building for strength and already had the plywood so it was an easy choice!
Seems easier to glass over a square stringer than over some added cleat.
dburr do you think over drilling each hole and filling with epoxy then tapping would be strong enough to solve the end grain strength issue? 3/4 inch overall bore that goes down into all 3 stringer plys 3 inches filled with epoxy then drilled to take a 1/4 diameter 3 inch long stainless screw?
(Yellow object is PL Premium used to bed sole to stringer tops)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/SoleAttachment.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5142&title=soleattachment&cat=500)
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That would take care of the console if the line up is on center of the stringer, but you are not leaving yourself much room for missalignment and keep in mind there is no where near the force on that as will be the T top.. The cleats could/can be beveled to make the glassing easier and the landing options are endless, pre formed FRP, Micarta, G-10, and good old ply.. The extra thickness also adds strength in both tension and compression, think I beam, and a place for the T top to land..
Take a look at grans post, Miss Delmarva pis at last and look at the stuff used to land his deck to hull, that is preformed FRP and will out last all of us..
Do you have a plan for mounting the T top? There is a pile of force on the feet at 40kts, again, another advantage for a landing on the stringers or cleats...
If you are happy with the fit margins and are confident it is strong enough then that is what counts. Remember that opinions and concerns offerd here are free and can be worth as much.
I am a fan of the trapezoid stringer and a big landing area for the decks and appendages :wink: ...
With the best of intentions...
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Thanks again dburr.
I like the trapezoid stringer shape too and know that is the strongest. Just wish my originals weren't so badly trashed and I could have kept them.
I think I am going to add boxes/trapezoids to the area of my stringers where I know the console and t-top will mount. Then I have more support to land on and it won't require a complete rebuild of my already completed stringers.
Added boxes in RED.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/StringerLayout_w_Trapezoids.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5143&title=stringerlayout-w-trapezoids&cat=500)
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Looking good! Sound advice youre getting too. Just an idea, on the underside of those red boxes you could glass in some aluminum plate to drill and tap into for top legs. I would just as soon bolt it totally to the console though. But i think you said it was already finished? Was just out your way in may, got salt creek a few feet overhead to ourselves for a couple hours, great wave!
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dirtwheelsfl
I thought of backing plates before but didn't really know how to attach them. Maybe 8x8 aluminum angle drilled and bolt it to the stringer? (Shown in BLUE)
Does aluminum need to be treaded or sealed before glassing over?
That would be much cheaper and less time consuming than builing boxes/trapezoids. As long as I don't have to gusset it because I don't have a TIG welder.
Salt Creek is a really fun wave. Gets crazy crowded almost every day but its one of the better barrel spots around here.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Aluminum_angle_iron_small.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5144&title=aluminum-angle-iron-small&cat=500)
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just a good grinding will do on the aluminum, make sure you lay it up before it starts oxidizing though, which is very quick. i wouldnt want it bedded onto raw wood, make sure its bedded onto glass. going the angle route, i dont think gussets would be necessary. the stringer is going to take any downward load on the angle, which is going to be nil anyway. that setup will be very rigid when everything is working together (deck, alum. angle, stringers). id use an etching primer on the aluminum if you go the angle route, and cover that with a good epoxy paint. and use alot of tef-gel on the screws!
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That'll get the job done... wouldn't hurt to go heavy on the tab layup on the stringers beneath the angle.
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Aluminum angle is a great idea... Up this way aluminum channel is used for engine beds and is epoxied and bolted to the frames and stringers.. Be way faster the building up for the cleats.. Nice CAD.. What are you using? An option for the 8x if you go that way is it can be glued to the underside of the deck before you lay it down..
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That angle aluminum is perfect- one suggestion: Maybe if you have clearance, I would put the "down" side of the alum on the "inside" wall of the stringer, so the top (flat side that the floor will rest on) also sits on the top of the stringer... still facing the same way you have it in the drawing, just on the opposite side of that stringer. That way your not relying only on bolts to hold it in place.
Hope that makes sense...
Great CAD drawings by the way...
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That angle aluminum is perfect- one suggestion: Maybe if you have clearance, I would put the "down" side of the alum on the "inside" wall of the stringer, so the top (flat side that the floor will rest on) also sits on the top of the stringer... still facing the same way you have it in the drawing, just on the opposite side of that stringer. That way your not relying only on bolts to hold it in place.
Hope that makes sense...
Great CAD drawings by the way...
Smart
Total beef. If extra width is needed...go with the next option up...ten inch.
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And don't forget...you will need crown on that floor, the 3/16th's plate sitting on top of the stringers as love2 suggests will give you that.
This is gonna come out deluxe :thumright:
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Thanks everyone for the suggestions.
I may be able to put the angle aluminum on the inside wall but it may be tight with my new fuel tank after wrapping the stringers in 2 layers of 1708 and then foam. Planning on epoxying the aluminum to the stringer then through bolt it with stainless bolts, washers, nylocknuts.
Do I need to use angle aluminum for the plywood deck seams too or can I just screw the plywood to the stringers since they won’t receive as much force as the console or t-top section? Shown in RED
I’m using SolidWorks CAD for my diagrams. If anyone ever needs an item roughed in CAD just let me know and I can build it for you.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Stringers_Console_Ttop_baitwell.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5148&title=stringers-console-ttop-baitwell&cat=500)
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using the aluminum might be over-kill on every joint for your deck (and $$$), but if you have access or extra why not. Not sure where you are getting your glass and resin, but if it's an actual fiberglass shop- they should be able to get some 2 or 4lb "foam" strips for you. They are usually 3/4", 1", or 2" think and come in different widths/lengths. You could easily cut those and glass them to what you already have going to add some width to the ribs where you are going to join your floor sheets.
If I remember correctly, from the transom forward to where the casting deck starts is 14'. so I'd start at the transom and work forward so you have full width sheets (going from side to side so your grains of the plywood are perpendicular to the stringers for maximum strength). So you should only have to beef up 3 of your ribs/bulkheads. Assuming you are going to keep the original casting deck design of the boat.
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Love the CAD work - sharp and easy to see the parts :salut:
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(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Liner_spacers.jpg)
Hope this is not too stupid of a question - What do you call/part#of the heavy glass "mat" layer that we see in the lower part of the pic?
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Looks like 18 oz roven to me maybe 24 oz. Standard layup for the day. Phased out by stitched bias plies nowadays. Heavy, not very strong, and soaks up alot of resin!
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Entire floor was grinded and sanded then covered in one layer of 1708 except in the rear where there was a lot of oil canning so I used 2 layers of 1708 and one layer of 24 oz roving.
I thought it looked new. So h2O, were you just trying to build it up in thickness?
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oh i see it now, a whole layer of biaxial in the bottom. i did the same thing, overlapped in the keel and an extra layer in the chines. its much nicer glassing to that than the old woven...
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I will have to check and see if my local supplier (Crystaliner) has foam strips that I could use for cleats instead of angle aluminum for the deck seams.
There is a local steel supplier I use for all my fab projects but I haven't priced out the angle aluminum yet $$$.
That is 24 oz roving in the pic over the top of 2 layers of 1708. I have about 100 yrds of 24 oz roving and 18 oz unidirectional that I got for dirt cheap from a local fab shop that builds trophy trucks, I guess they use both for building body kits. It was a test to see how much resin is sucks up and the result confirmed that I won't be using either because they suck up resin like a sponge! 18 oz unidirectional is ridiculously thirsty.
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I bed my stringers in last night using PL Premium adhesive. Really surprised it bubbled as much as it did when curing. Decided to give it enough time to cure and then shave off the bubbles before tabbing stringers in today.
Tripple sandwiched 1/2 inch ACX plywood stringers look beefy against the hull. But they are also heavy so I know why everyone else has been using foam stringers instead.
Used 1 layer of 8 inch 1708 to tab stringers.
Is 1 layer of tabbing enough with 2 additional layers of 1708 over the entire stringers?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Stringers_tabbed2.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5160&title=stringers-tabbed2&cat=500)
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Looking good, nice work today.
Glad you've joined, have enjoyed the conciseness of your posts.
Recommended you over-tab the stringers beneath the console given the stress above, but that's about it, great work.
Regarding weight...when you begin glassing....the resin is the culprit.
Take a close look at excess weight... with closed transom, less bracket, dry weight less power...2200 pounds is a good number.
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The ACX may be dense...but properly sealed will go thirty years or more.
The Carolina commercial builders proudly use glassed AC fir..stringers, transoms, and decks.
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Yea one tab is enough, granted the 2 layers covering the whole stringer have tabs incorporated into em too. About ten inches out into the hull shouldbe good.
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Good suggestion. I double tabbed the section below the console and t-top area to give it some extra strength last night.
Bought 20 yards of 50 inch wide 1708 today on my lunch break. Sounds like a lot but my calculations show it will be just enough to do both 16 foot stringers in 2 layers with 10 inches on the hull on either side of each stringer.
When you guys prep the previous layer of 1708 how much to you sand off? Just the tops of the stitch and the tops of the 1st layer of biax? Or do you grind it down all the way so the grooves are all gone and completely flat?
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Here's another idea I am working on.
I knew I should have closed in my transom a bit even though I am not going to use a jack plate or port-a-brace but ended up keeping the stock transom shape anyway. Shown in BROWN.
My transom is sandwiched 3/4 inch and I want to build a closed section out of 1/2 inch permanently onto the top section of the thicker transom. Saves weight (and is an after thought). Shown in RED.
I will incorporate a detachable splashwell. Shown in BLUE
Attached with thickened epoxy and wrapped in 2 layers of 1708 should be strong enough? Or did I blow it on not planning that in advance?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Transom_with_splashwell.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5167&title=transom-with-splashwell&cat=500)
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That software of yours is very deluxe.
The brown is continuous (no cutout) behind the blue at 25 inches correct?
The blue splashwell....where would it drain, and can the motor fully tilt without hitting it? (Thinking safety in an emergency)
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SolidWorks is awesome. I am still learning it but it has helped me build a lot of projects and catch fitment and clearance issues before I wasted material.
Yes the brown is continuous at 25 inches behind the blue and doesn't have a cut out.
The splashwell would be built after installing the Evinrude to make sure it doesn't hit and so it is removable.
Hmm, didn't think about the drain. I guess I could make the well a lot shallower so it just self bails?
Or does the engine tilt below the 25 inch line?
I would be OK with a small amount of water trapped in there temporarily while out on the water.
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Certainly would have been less work to put it in beforehand. But 2 layers should be fine overlapping to whats already there a good bit. When youre laminating onto cured stuff you just need to "liability sand". Which is pretty much just getting burrs and sharp spots off. Youre never going to get down into the weave. Just try and get as much of the shiny off as you can. Not that big of a deal with epoxy.
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You should be plenty good without the splashwell. The red extension is a built-in wave gate. Both sides up tight to the engine, when the engine is in the full hard-over position port and starboard. Let the engine clear the extension by 1/4 inch either side....even in a heavy following sea, you'll be surprised how effective it is :thumright:
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Thanks gran398
I have actually searched a few times previously for info on wave gates but never found anything really appealing. Just some king starboard screwed onto some transoms and I didn't like that look.
Made the mistake of not measuring the position of full turn to turn on my motor before taking it off. Guess I will have to put it back on to measure especially if it should be 1/4 inch from either side of engine.
Getting so tired of sanding...
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Finally finished laying 2 layers of 1708 over both stringers. Now I'm starting to put the ribs in and wanted to know how you guys dealt with the old sole?
I was planning on screwing and gluing the new sole on top of the old sole ledge I left when I cut out the old floor.
Should I cut out all the original sole core wood and replace it? Or should I just wrap it in glass so it is sealed?
Right now I have a 2 inch ledge from the old sole all the way around the hull. Suggestions?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Sole2.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5303&title=sole2&cat=500)
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How is the condition of the existing ply?
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If its dry, just seal that end grain with a few coats of epoxy. Make sure the screws dont poke thru the underside!
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Plywood is all dry and has been cut open for months airing out. Also have a boat cover over it at night to make sure any rain or dew doesn't get in the hull since I haven't drilled a new bilge hole yet after replacing transom.
There doesn't appear to be any rot on that wood but I don't know how it looks on the side I can't see where it's tabbed to liner.
Should I use regular laminating resin or thicken it up with West System 406 to seal the edge?
Thanks
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The thinner the better. You really want it to wick into that end grain.
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Finally took some pics of my progress. Ribs are all tabbed and glassed. Also have 2 of the 4 bulkheads bedded with PL Premium adhesive against the hull to prevent hard spots and thickened epoxy attaching to stringers for strength. Planning on bedding in the other 2 bulkheads by Friday and finishing tabbing and glassing by the weekend.
Also ripped a 3 inch PVC conduit pipe for the center stringer and added a 3 layer sandwiched 1/2 inch ACX bow stringer like the factory had used.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/IMG_1144.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5429&title=img-1144&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/IMG_1158.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5430&title=img-1158&cat=500)
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I finished glassing in the bulkheads this weekend now getting ready to put in the new gas tank (52 gal polyethylene).
I built a coffin and am going to foam in the tank hopefully this week. The tank will rest on neoprene strips which I learned from reading other forums.
My questions are:
1) Do I need to use some type of straps to hold the tank in? or is the foam good enough?
2) My local boat builder has 2 part pour foam that is 4lb density. They use generic resins and foams which so far I have stayed away from (Rhino brand). Is there any specific type of foam that works better than the rest? or some that should be avoided?
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Tank install:
You're on the right track. Less is more in terms of holding moisture/air circulation.
Use one 2.5 gallon freezer bag per each corner as a chock, then lightly inject the four bags with foam.
Tie in from above with hollow fiberglass 2 X 2 girders. See the rebuild thread "Miss Delmarva" for pics describing above.
Other ways too. Saw another tank install here recently. A bit different, but great work. No dissimilar metals, no galvanic crosstalk, no rubber leeching, no arsenic from treated lumber, etc.
Another means to the same end....no crevice corrosion/leeching corrosion issues down the road.
The above is applicable to aluminum tanks. Yours is poly...would still go with the glass girders as the tie-down. Poly tank...must allow for quick expansion. No heavy foam...the corner foam with the girder system described above will be ideal for you.
PS...Your stringer work/glass work is deluxe.
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Thanks gran
The Miss DelMarva post is great, that's what I was looking for. That is a killer boat. I see the 2x2 girders but don't actually have enough clearance under my deck for those. It's a real tight fit with my tank. Will probably have to go with angle iron screwed to the stringers then resting on top of the tank. Unless I build really thick 1x1 girders to offset strength in a smaller size.
I went and looked at the foam from my local supplier and they don't know enough about, said it's 4lb density but the label says clearly 2lb. They even had a test batch cured and it felt really soft so I placed an order with US Composites for the 4lb foam kit instead but have to wait about a week for shipping. So no gas tank install this week.
Still stuck on how to setup cleats to attach the new floor to. Not sure what is easiest, strongest, not too expensive, and doesn't require running glass on each stringer/rib/bulkhead cap again. I have spent hours searching this without a method I really like.
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I'd stay away from the foam all together. If you strap the tank down and its secure, there is no need for foam. And as Gran mentioned that poly tank is going to expand once you put fuel in it and if its foamed in it may crack.
The issue I see with your tank is going to be getting the fill hose on the tank.
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That's true Fern.
I'm going by Seamark tomorrow morning, they install poly tanks in all of their rides....I'll inquire as to their method.
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I have seen a lot of rebuilds where they foam in polyethylene tanks as well as read all the discussions about pros and cons of poly vs aluminum. Thought I had it figured out but I'm happy you both commented on this.
Originally bought my Moeller poly tank because it was the largest tank with the best fit between the factory stringers but that all changed when I set the tank in there the 1st time and noticed how trashed the stock stringers were which sparked the whole interior tear out.
You are right, read it right on the Moeller website, "do not foam in tank" due to 2-3% expansion.
Also found the Moeller installation instructions for securing my tank using a Tank Cradle Hold Down Kit:
http://www.moellermarine.com/sites/moel ... ctions.pdf (http://www.moellermarine.com/sites/moellermarine/files/300110_tank_cradle_hold_down_kit__instructions.pdf)
Thought I did my research but missed something. Maybe I will start searching for an aluminum tank now but spent a lot of $ on my poly tank. Thanks for checking with Seamark.
I will have an access panel over the plumbing connections area of the tank inside my center console so I can easily get to the hoses and sending unit. Also planning on cutting a hole in the starboard stringer to route the fill hose to the factory deck fill similar to the original layout but without that big notch in the stringer.
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H2O, if you don't have a problem with cutting a hole in the std. stringer and the forward bulkhead to run the fill hose I don't see a reason you can't keep the poly tank. If you do decide you want an aluminum tank, you can have one custom made to fit your fuel cell and have the fill, vent, pickup, and sender placed where you want them. Again, even with an aluminum tank I'd stay way from foaming in the tank.
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H2O,
Didn't make it this morn, will be tomorrow. Will advise, tx.
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Rigging tubes are in. 3 inch schedule 40 PVC.
The plugs that fell out of the stringers with the hole saw are 2 inches thick and really give me confidence that they are built super strong.
Next going to cut and run the bow wiring tube with 1.5 inch PVC as well as the in and out tubes for my baitwell.
Anyone have suggestions on the diameter of pipe I should use for the baitwell? 2 inch PVC?
Also, the old baitwell outflow pipe exited the transom under the surface of the water. Is that standard or should it be above the hull waterline like a bilge bulkhead?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/RigginTubes.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5455&title=riggintubes&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/GasTank.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5454&title=gastank&cat=500)
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Very nice work! I would think that if you have below the waterline drains, and the boat sits for any length of time in the water you could get some yucky marine growth in them.
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Looking good! Limber holes in those bulkheads are a must in my opinion though. Water needs to be able to go somewhere
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Necessary Evil- my boat will always be trailered and not in the water for more than a weekend at a time so I probably don't have to worry about stuff growing on the outflow pipe that quick right?
I'm thinking I will use flex line similar to the hose on my fuel fill to plumb the baitwell. Makes more sense than rigid pipe I think and I can route it to not take up as much space and without 45 degree kinks to allow better flow.
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Those 2 most recent pics kind of hide the limber holes in the ribs but each one has a 2 inch hole where the rib meets the stringer. Good catch tho. I still need to drill the limber holes in the last compartment that drain from the rib cells down into the bilge at the transom.
Ripped a 3 inch PVC pipe today into half circles to act as a tunnel in a few of the rib compartments so I can pour 2lb floatation foam in those cells and still have water drain under them to the back bilge pickups. Will probably just run some 6oz glass over the pvc to hold it in place since its not structural.
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It's been a while. Honestly got burned out on sanding every day but finally back at it.
Had to make a tent over the hull to control some of the sanding dust and keep it dry approaching our rain/winter season.
Drilled, glued, and screwed aluminum angle brackets to each stringer and rib to support floor seams.
Patterned and cut out the entire floor from 3/4 inch ACX and then covered bottom with 6oz glass. Planning on doubled 1708 for top side.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Deck.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=6198&title=deck&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Hatches2.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=6200&title=hatches2&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Hatch.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=6199&title=hatch&cat=500)
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Welcome back.
Lookin' good. :thumleft:
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Ditto what CB said.
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I have never used an epoxy pigment before but experimented with the West System 503 Gray added to my US Composites resin. It doesn't take much to color it and looks just like thin paint but really seems to thicken the final cured resin and make it much easier to see flaws and spots that need to be sanded.
Anyone have any suggestions or techniques for wrapping edges of 1/2 plywood that has been rounded with a 1/4 inch router bit?
I'm having trouble with such a tight bend and the glass doesn't want to stay flat.
Is crowsfoot weave better for this?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/hatch_lip.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=6205&title=hatch-lip&cat=500)
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It looks like youre trying to tab that flange and wrap the underside of the flange at the same time? (same piece of cloth). Nearly impossible without voids. I would use 2 seperate pieces of cloth, one to cover the top radius and one to then wrap the flange. Lighter cloth will make the bend easier too, something like a 4 oz. Looks like youre presoaking the wood in epoxy too, let that cure and sand it smooth (just enough to get the shiny off) thatll help it lay better when you do glass it.
Top notch work by the way!
heres what i meant:
(http://i788.photobucket.com/albums/yy167/dirtwheelsfl/Hatch.jpg)
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I agree with dirt and was kinda what I was thinking. 2 pieces for sure and I was taught to not cut the glass in some circumstances but tear it apart so there is a lot of thread fibers exposed and they will mesh at the joint with the next piece when you do wet-on-wet and it'll give it more strength. Maybe the type of material you'll be using won't allow you to tear it though.
Something to think about.
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Good suggestion using 2 pieces, that made it way easier. Seems the glass doesn't like to have multiple curves in it even if they are all in the same direction. I ended up buying a yard of 20oz crowfoot weave from my local supplier to try and the stuff is great. 20oz crowfoot contours better to curves than 6 oz standard E-glass. Would have never guessed that.
I have 2 layers of 6oz on top and another 2 layers of 6oz on bottom with the 20oz wrapped over all of it. So just part of the curved lip has only 20oz glass but that should be strong enough to not break and leak?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/edge_wrap.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=6207&title=edge-wrap&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/crowsfoot_weave_20oz.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=6206&title=crowsfoot-weave-20oz&cat=500)
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I dont see any voids :thumleft:
whats that 20 oz look like dry?
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Here's a pic of the crowsfoot without resin. It looks even better over unpainted plywood but my previous pic was over the top of pigmented gray glass.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Crowsfoot.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=6234&title=crowsfoot&cat=500)
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So I'm running low on resin... again (already over 35 gallons into this project). My plywood floor is in and ready for glassing but I only have enough resin to do the tabbing and possibly 6oz over the entire wood floor while waiting for my shipment.
I don't really want to leave the raw wood sitting for up to 2 weeks while the resin ships.
Will it hurt anything or cause any weakness if I glass the entire floor with 6oz glass to seal it from moisture 2 weeks prior to glassing it all over again with 2 layers of 1708?
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So I'm running low on resin... again (already over 35 gallons into this project). My plywood floor is in and ready for glassing but I only have enough resin to do the tabbing and possibly 6oz over the entire wood floor while waiting for my shipment.
I don't really want to leave the raw wood sitting for up to 2 weeks while the resin ships.
Will it hurt anything or cause any weakness if I glass the entire floor with 6oz glass to seal it from moisture 2 weeks prior to glassing it all over again with 2 layers of 1708?
May I ask why you are putting 2 layers of 1708 on a ply deck? One layer of 6oz on the bottom and top would be plenty, and if you wanted the extra impact resistance one layer of 12oz would do the trick. Two layers of 1708 sounds more like a lamination schedule for a foam or honeycomb core deck. If you were using polyester resign that would make a difference too, but epoxy's properties are much different and it is a much stronger material.
I'm not trying to be critical, and I hope it doesn't offend you. I'm just save you the extra cost and weight of that much extra material.
BTW, the project is looking awesome! I really like the layout of the floor. :thumright:
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h20,
You are getting a sweet job, looking forward to seeing her come along <!-- s:thumright: -->:thumright:<!-- s:thumright: -->
Cally makes a great point about the deck. The builder here has a chopper gun, best I recall he uses one good layer of the bottom, two on the top, rolls both sides out, that's pretty much it. Nice and sealed, strong, yet keeps the weight down.
They build all AC fir, here are some pics:
http://classicaquasport.com/smf/index.php?topic=9949.25
A link to their website:
<!-- m -->http://www.seamarkboats.com/ (http://www.seamarkboats.com/)<!-- m -->
Keep up the fine work!
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On my 170 I used 5/8" plywood and just resin coated the bottom. When I pulled the floor out this past Sunday 98% looked just like I put it in 14 years ago - still looked new. The other 2% was the reason I replaced it - somehow water got into it and destroyed an area adjacent to my casting platform. Maybe fiberglass, resin and gelocat aren't waterproof?
Anyway, putting glass on the bottom I guess couldn't hurt but resin coating seemed to be just fine too.
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Shouldnt be a problem. Another option might be to coat the whole deck in just epoxy and skip the 6 oz. Then when you get your shipment, scuff n clean then lay your 1708. You could put a 6 oz over that as well. Give you a smoother finish and more abrasion protection. 2 layers of 1708 wont hurt the boat or weigh that much, but itll definitely hurt the wallet...
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Thanks for all the suggestions. It's great to hear that I don't need to run a double layer of 1708.
I refer back to LilRichard's build a lot because it has great pics of the whole build process but he used 3615 plus another 1808 on his plywood deck so I thought it had to be pretty thick.
I think I will run resin with no glass for now just to seal it then scuff it up prior to glassing it once I have my resin order.
With the floor glued and screwed do I also need to use tabbing over the floor seams where each sheet of plywood meets the next?
Or can I just overlap the 1708 over the seams when I lay the entire floor glass?
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Your doing a really good job on your boat. I really like the alium. Angle for mounting. But use loctite on your bolts, going into the alium. It will act as a barrier coat, between the alium. And the sst bolts. To prevent corrosion from building up and eating away the alium. and it will help the bolts from vibrating loose over time. You will be able to get it a part later. Loctite isn't that hard to break free. :thumleft:
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somehow water got into it and destroyed an area adjacent to my casting platform. Maybe fiberglass, resin and gelocat aren't waterproof?
Polyester will allow water to penetrate it over time. Vinylester is better about it, and Epoxy is the most "waterproof". Also please see below...
On my 170 I used 5/8" plywood and just resin coated the bottom.
I think I will run resin with no glass for now just to seal it then scuff it up prior to glassing it once I have my resin order.
With the floor glued and screwed do I also need to use tabbing over the floor seams where each sheet of plywood meets the next?
Or can I just overlap the 1708 over the seams when I lay the entire floor glass?
AC Fir has a tendency to check over time when just coated with resin, 6oz glass will provide enough strength to keep that from happening. This may have been at play in Rick's boat???
H20, for whatever it's worth, I would go with the 6oz on the bottom. If you have the 1708 to cover the floor (and it gives you a better feeling about it) I would glue the floor down, remove all of the screws (fill the holes), seal coat the wood, fill the seams with thickened epoxy, and put your glass down (if your going with 1708).
Also, I don't really like giving advice online. You don't know me or what I know or don't...I guess what I'm saying is everyone is an expert online. I might be a crazy for all you know... :geek: :rabbit: :geek: :rabbit: :geek:
Check around, I'll do my best not to steer you wrong with the glass stuff though. :thumright:
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With the floor glued and screwed do I also need to use tabbing over the floor seams where each sheet of plywood meets the next?
Or can I just overlap the 1708 over the seams when I lay the entire floor glass?
It depends on the butt blocks( or lack thereof) on the bottom side of the deck. If youve got nice big butt blocks (which it should), or in your case aluminum? then you dont need to tape the seam , although it will wont hurt. I always countersink the screws and leave them in for the mechanical aspect of holding the deck down, and fill the heads with thickened epoxy before glassing. Make sure theyre stainless too!
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Will call Seamark in the morning and get their exact deck layup using AC fir ply, and post back.
Have run their 21 this summer as a loaner. The boat is stout, and built to last.
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The bottom of the floor pieces has already been laminated with 2 layers of 6oz glass from when I built the hatch drip lips. I have a ton of 6oz left so I will just glass it on top for now as a sealer since it doesn't seem to take much resin to wet it out.
I am planning on leaving all the stainless screws in for a mechanical bond. I have been countersinking and then thickened epoxying over all the #12 screws used so far for other components.
The butt blocks are aluminum angle that are sanded and attached with thickened epoxy and stainless bolts with nylon lock nuts. The way I built my hatches will allow me to reach under every deck screw through the bilge so I can coat them with 5200 once I'm finished to prevent corrosion.
You can see my aluminum angle supports in this pic along with today's work. Coated the first few bilge compartments with Macropoxy 646. I wanted to use Tile-Clad HS but was told it is not available in CA due to environmental restrictions on its ingredients. The 646 is 2 part epoxy paint classified for use on submerged salt water applications. It goes on thick and is self leveling and looks great.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/photo-1.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=6236&title=photo-1&cat=500)
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Looks nice n clean! Oughta be like walking on concrete...
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Your work is deluxe.
To the extent your deck glassing is complete, will forgo the call.
Keep the pics coming.
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Man, that looks awesome! I didn't realize you were using aluminum angle to anchor the deck, that thing is going to be solid.
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Still couldn't hurt to know the schedule. Do they use wood for the sole too?
Will call Seamark in the morning and get their exact deck layup using AC fir ply, and post back.
Have run their 21 this summer as a loaner. The boat is stout, and built to last.
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Happy Thanksgiving. Got a little more work done today with the Macropoxy 646. Starting to look like a boat again...finally.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/photo-2.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=6237&title=photo-2&cat=500)
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Looking really nice :salut:
When you ran your rigging tubes I know that you can extend the tubes in the front up above the floor a couple inches so water can't get in. Without a closed in transom how are you going to keep water (rain, washdown, hopefully no waves) from gettin in the tubes in the aft?
Reason I ask is I am going to have the original transom shape and it will remain open. I have the original trough for rigging and wiring going back to the engine from the console. The idea of the trough is that you can seal the topside of the boat from the bilge (there were no hatches into the bilge). I am thinking it might still be the best way for me to route rigging. I am going to move my fuel tank below my deck so I will have to have some method to get to the fuel tank (a hatch), so the bilge will not be sealed tight like in the old days.
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I'm thinking I will use a PVC cap on top of the transom risers I have coming out of the rigging tubes. I will cut them in half down the middle after I use a hole saw to make the opening for wires and controls to exit. Then I will probably use a 5200 or other caulking product to seal it water tight. A stainless hose clamp will keep the the cap together along with the caulk. It's an inexpensive solution but we will see how it looks. There are probably some other options too, like a rubber boot on some of the newer boats which I'm sure I can find at an OEM dealer.
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Gas tank is in and strapped. Attachment holes were overdrilled, filled with thickened epoxy, then redrilled for stainless screws that were also bedded in 5200. 3 straps to prevent vertical tank movement and 1 strap to prevent horizontal tank movement. I went with the 3/8 inch neoprene strips above, below, and all around tank.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/gastank1.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=6263&title=gastank1&cat=500)
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More setbacks. Floor is completely done and ready to be glued and screwed but as I was prepping the old sole edge that I will be attaching the new sole to I found more rotten wood. The outter edges looked good and solid so I wet them out with 2 coats of epoxy followed by a 3rd layer of thickened epoxy about 1 month ago. All that is getting cut out now. (pic here is before they were sealed with epoxy)
Previous owner had put some trim around the entire sole where it meets the side liner. Small screw holes into the wood every 6 inches that were not sealed and then later painted over. As the paint sanded off I found hole after hole of worm wood. Also found 4 pieces of plywood glassed into the liner walls at the bottom. Maybe these are where the old cap supports screwed into?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Liner_spacers1.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=6268&title=liner-spacers1&cat=500)
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That is a BEAUTIFUL hull!! Hell, with the L-angle, you wouldn't even need any bonding putty!
Just my 2 cents here on rigging tube 90s. Those of us that take some of these older boats and re-wire and/or re-rig them, we typically use an old shift cable as a snake. A lot of older boats, either the pull wire isn't there, or it has gotten horribly lost in the wiring mess below decks. Might I suggest 45s instead of 90s? The end of a universal cable likes a 45 a WHOLE lot better than a 90...
Just my 2 cents...
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Sorry you've hit a snag on the sides.
Once the old comes out, you can glass in some FRP chocks. If you can't find them there, let us know.
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Seabob I think 45s would be better for rigging tubes also but unfortunately these are in for life. It would take some serious demo to get them out. I'm a rookie when it comes to rigging so I'm sure I will remember this suggestion when I'm having trouble pulling stuff through. Hopefully these 4 inch tubes will allow a bit of extra room.
Gran what are FRP chocks? or what does FRP stand for?
I google searched and it looks like prefab bars/cleats that are fiberglass and epoxy? Is there a manufacturer (brand) for them?
I was planning on using 1" thick ACX to replace the old rotten balsa but something other than wood sounds better for the long term.
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Fiberglass Reinforced Plastic. We used hollow 2 X 2 inch "girders", one long piece per side, scored with a skilsaw so they would curve.
PM sent.
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Cut out all of the old floor edge balsa I was going to attach my new sole to. Re-wrapped the edges in 2 layers of 1708 to act as a screw flange with sealed 1/2 inch ACX on top bed in with thickened epoxy. Screwed and glued in the floor which took almost 4 hours. I used 3M 5200 to attach floor to stringers after scratching them up really good with 60 grit but man is that 5200 thick! Palms of my hands have holes in them from squeezing the caulking gun for 20 tubes.
110 stainless steel #12 screws were removed after the 5200 set and each pilot hole was wet out with penetrating epoxy, screws were replaced and heads filled in with thickened epoxy. Can't wait to glass the top of the floor and get some primer on there.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/floors_in.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=6332&title=floors-in&cat=500)
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Why not bed in epoxy glue? the aluminum? Probably a tenth of the cost of 20 tubes. Looking real clean! Whats going on top of the deck?
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Aluminum was all bed with thickened epoxy before they were bolted in but the weather here has been really drastic lately and my thickened epoxy batches are kicking too fast. I couldn't get enough made and spread on the flanges, ribs, and stringers to where I thought it was getting a good bond. 5200 is pricey but I got a deal from a contractor buddy on cases. Rock solid with the 3/4 deck and all the screws.
Deck will be tabbed with 1708 all the way around then covered in 20 oz crows foot weave with a 6 oz on top for smoothness.
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I gotcha. Leaving the screws in is the way to go...
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Haven't posted for a while but still been working on it slowly.
Some progress on the floor. Got everything glassed in and sanded all drip hatch edges.
These pics show the 1st half of the glass down. 20oz crowsfoot weave with 60z over the top for smoothness.
More pics to come showing fully sanded floor soon.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Half_glassed.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=6965&title=half-glassed&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Glassed.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=6964&title=glassed&cat=500)
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Real clean! Scored some good swell out your way last month btw! Baja was the deal though..
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Looking very nice :salut:
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I'm going to build some supports that run up the walls of the liner to prevent sagging of the top cap (similar to what LilRichard did).
Is the top cap supposed to be level across from side to side or do most boats have an outward slope so water rolls off?
If curved, how much slope?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Hull_curvature.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7009&title=hull-curvature&cat=500)
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Finished bow seating arrangement. Went a little overboard on my entire floor design and the number of access hatches. 13 in all including gas tank.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/IMG_0140.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7202&title=img-0140&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/IMG_0138.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7201&title=img-0138&cat=500)
Also made some side hull supports to strengthen the cap. This was my first attempt at using a mold. Plywood and a 2x4 with routed edges then screwed together, wrapped in duct tape, wrapped in packing tape. Pulled off super clean. 4 layers of 1708. There will be 2 of these on each side of the hull running vertically.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/IMG_0130.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7203&title=img-0130&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/IMG_0133.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7204&title=img-0133&cat=500)
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I can't recall seeing something on that scale before. :idea:
Good luck.
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looks good. not sure if you have cut your caps supports to length yet, but my cap has a little slope to the outside.
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Nice clean work. Looks great. :salut:
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I haven't cut the side hull supports yet but popped the other 2 off the molds last night.
Hopefully going to pull the cap off this weekend.
Thanks for the info on outward curve love2fish.
Does anyone know what is inside the molded in splash rail on the top cap? Is it a wood core, foam core, or just created by the original mold?
I want to replace all of the core in the top cap so planning on laying it upside down and cutting out all the material with a die grinder. Current glass under the cap is paper thin and has tons of holes and exposed wood.
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The lip should just be an all glass channel. I filled one side of mine with foam strips and glassed over, and put a conduit for nav lights in the other side and glassed over. Id just fill yours with foam for the glass to lay on and put a layer of biax on it, then continue replacing the cores.
Get a cheap masonry blade for your 4.5" grinder. Will be much faster and cleaner than a die grinder..
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Rather than core it, we made a long triangular glass reinforcement underneath. Not solid glass...just a bridge if you will
(http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh301/seabob4/Scott%20Rhodes%2022-2/Speakerflat_zpsb99708c2.jpg)
Good and stiff...lightweight....easy....cheaper than core.....and much less time.
One other thing, everyone says it, but worth repeating over and over. Make sure when you lay it upside down you note the hull curvature. We laid ours out flat...big mistake. Had to take a skilsaw to it, score it, and re-glass.
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Good to hear I don't have to dig a bunch of material out of the rail mold. It looks so much like a 1x1 covered in glass I thought for sure I would be digging worm wood with a chisel for an entire day.
I like the idea of conduit as a core so I can run some wire through it. Probably can just bed it in there with PL Premium then glass over? Dirtwheels do you have any pics of the conduit in yours?
Gran thanks for the heads up on hull curvature. I would have blown that for sure! Will a 2x4 frame running width wise and length wise like a grid hold it to the correct shape? Or what other methods do you recommend?
Wasted 2 hours trying to drill out a few of the old rivets holding the cap to hull. They just spin and get hot and melt the hole. I searched and saw cutting a line through the head then hammering off with a chisel? Previous owner put a ton of machine screws with nuts through the cap and none of them are stainless so there are probably over 200 completely rusted fasteners to remove.
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Re the cap curvature:
While it is on the boat, run a string (plumb line) a measured position down from the point of the bow...then run the string to the stern. Take height measurements at various points from the string to the fiberglass. This will give the curvature.
When you flip it upside down....you'll need to add the specified height in reverse when you place it on the sawhorses. That is, the center sawhorse will be higher. It doesn't have to be exact....the cap is pretty flexible. But you sure don't want to do it flat like we did.
Re the screw removal:
If you can get them all out that would be best. At some point, even the best stainless will sometimes leech color (rust) and potentially stain your hull sides.
Thanks and keep us posted!
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Dont have any pics of it, but anything to tack it in will work. The lip on your cap stops about the middle of the boat right? Meaning youd probably end it in those side boxes you just made and run wires thru those. The lip on mine ran all the way to the transom so i ended the conduit back there. Thats an option, but it just wont be flush inside of the back half of your lip. All im running thru there is nav light wires, I just hate leaving wires dangling under a cap and relying on whatever adhesive to keep em up.
Scotts right about the cap. Just manipulate whatever youre setting the cap on to get the sheer curve pretty close. Itll still move a decent amout depending on how much structure you put into the underside.
I buttered up that whole outside hull side of that joint with epoxy and then set the cap on and sucked it all together with temporary screws. Then went to the inside and tabbed it to the hullsides. Super strong, watertight, and no damn screws or rivets to mess with...
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What are you using to core the underside of the cap? I will be doing that too eventually, and would appreciate knowing what material and thickness is recommended to give it a very solid feel.
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Underside of the cap will be ACX plywood. Factory looks like 3/8" but I will probably bump that up to 1/2" just to get some additional stiffness out of it. Covered in 1-2 layers of 1708.
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Finished glassing the new bow section. Turned out pretty good and the rounded corners that I kerf cut look pretty smooth.
1/2" ACX plywood with 20oz of glass on bottom and 1708 on top. All edges and fillets double taped with 6oz glass.
Hopefully tabbed and done this weekend then finally done with the floor!
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Glassed_bow_underside.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7282&title=glassed-bow-underside&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Glassed_bow_top2.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7281&title=glassed-bow-top2&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Glassed_bow_top.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7280&title=glassed-bow-top&cat=500)
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That is one FINE job :thumright:
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Sanded off all of the gelcoat from the transom skin to bare glass so I can see every hole and fill it. Previous owner filled holes with black flexible caulking then MarineTex over the top. Spent hours digging out every single hole in the transom, beveling the edges then filling with thickened epoxy.
After drooling over so many other boats on here with the outboard brackets I pulled the trigger on building a custom one. 22" of setback with a 70" wide platform for a single engine and built in kicker mount. Should be done in 3 weeks and shipped from Miami to CA. I will be keeping the notched transom shape and adding a "wave gate" that will fold down to allow easy pass through onto the platform.
I know most of the transom brackets are used on enclosed transoms which are probably much stronger than a notched transom so I really want to make sure my transom can handle the extra torque. I rebuilt my transom from the inside but now want to put an extra 2 layers of 1708 on the outside skin to add some strength. Will there be any problem adding 2 layers just on the face of the transom and not wrapping around the sides of the hull?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/transom_holes_filled2.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7411&title=transom-holes-filled2&cat=500)
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I know most of the transom brackets are used on enclosed transoms which are probably much stronger than a notched transom so I really want to make sure my transom can handle the extra torque.
I wouldn't get too crazy worrying over using the bracket in a non fully enclosed hull. I had one on my CCP (it still is I believe) factory built transom with no real indication of over stressing. Of course you want to do a good job of attaching the stringers to the transom and the transom rebuild also. That's where your ability to resist a moment (god I love engineer speak) needs to be the greatest.
They do look nice enclosed but hey......
They look good with a bracket too :idea:
Good luck. :thumleft:
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Decided to wait to pull my top cap until the interior is all done and painted.
Side hull supports glassed in to liner and spent 2 days with a dremel doing some final touch-ups before applying fairing compound.
Little bit of a learning curve with fairing compound but once I started using a smaller putty knife for the detail work I kind of got the hang of it.
Transom bracket should be done soon and I am really excited to see what that will do to the boat with the walk through transom. Taking a 22' to 24' makes me feel like I will keep the boat longer. But I really want a 26'!
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/fairing2.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7475&title=interior-fairing&cat=500)
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Sure looks good :salut:
What are your plans to seal the access plates that you won't be opening a lot?
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Outstanding progress :thumright: :thumleft: !!! What is the plan for passing the rigging through the transom to the outboard?
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Finshed adding fairing compound to entire floor last night. Hopefully starting to longboard this evening.
I'm not sure what I will do to seal the access panels. Maybe route a chanel on the underside of each hatch then glue in some black rubber tubing to act as a gasket. I don't want hinges tho, a clean look with a single slam latch will be the only hardware showing. Not looking forward to building 13 access hatches...although I did keep each plywood cutout from when I built the floor and one side is already glassed in 2 layers of 6oz cloth.
I haven't figured out the rigging through the transom yet. I'm waiting for my transom bracket to arrive then I will mark and drill all the holes and try to figure out the best looking method of rigging. Also need to cut scuppers after the install to make sure they will clear the swim platform and be out of the way of trim tabs. I'm going to countersink some drain chanels for the scuppers so they sit about 0.5" below the main floor for easy draining. Any suggestions on rigging tube location would be great since I have no idea what I'm doing!
Thanks
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So guess you're going with stainless piano hinges as they are hidden.
The slam latches are available in a style that the cams adjust underneath to "lock" tight to the adjoining lip. You can push the hatch down a little into the neoprene you're speaking of...you should have a tight seal.
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Sorry, I guess they are not slam latches they are "turn latches" and have adjustable depth cam. I really like the Taco Marine F16-3000. They are only 3/32" high on the top flange of the surface mount.
I don't really want a piano hinge either. Was thinking about building a lobe that is permanently attached to the hatch lid that would just slip under the lip to hold it secure opposite side of the latch:
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/latch.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7481&title=latch&cat=500)
Any suggestion where to buy stainless latches for a good price? Do we have any members on here that have online stores and could ship to CA?
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How's this?
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=9764 (http://www.classicaquasport.com/phpbb3/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=9764)
The only thing about these latches is they are not true compression latches. Southco and Gemlux, among others, make nice compression latches. They may be better at "squeezing" a gasket if that is the way you go.
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IMO no hinges is a mistake. Every time you open a hatch you will need to place the hatch down on the deck which is a safety issue. Not only the hatch itself lying on the deck but the opening as well is a safety issue.
Piano hinges are an option, personally I'd go with these;
http://www.foreandaftmarine.com/AC-713.htm (http://www.foreandaftmarine.com/AC-713.htm)
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Agreed. Open a hatch, fish hits...someone slides on a hatch or steps in a hole. Or....wave breaks in the boat, bilge floods.
Think about piano hinges if you like the "no hinge" look.
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Absolutely killer progress!! :salut: :thumleft: :thumright:
Hinges x3!
The idea you have will work but what you will find that the seal on the off latch side is going to be hard to keep in place. The slide and pinch motion will tend to work it loose. I had that problem on cockpit bench seat hatches on a blow boat that I worked on. Plus when the engine was powered up they rattled horribly. We ended up going with the flush style in the James Town link..
Take a look at
http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/show_product.do?pid=2247&familyName=Hatch+Hinges
in Chromed bronze..
This is the style that is on the Osprey and they are rather rugged..
If you mortise these into the deck and hatch to a depth that is as deep as the top of the hinge joint you will not have to worry about smashing toes, but when opened the hatch will not lay flat on the deck without over stressing the hinge joint. That shouldn't be an issue with your layout, it looks like the hatches will swing and lean on the console or the sides of the hull. This type hinge will help hold the hatch down on a gasket too.
Another option is this type of jointed hinge
http://www.hardwaresource.com/hinges/SPECIALTY+HINGES/Hatch+Hinges+and+Hardware/
this style can be mounted dead flush and the joint will allow the hatch to open and lay flat, BUT!, when you put a gasket under the hatch the joint will stick up and grab your toes...
In either case, with only one latch you will not get a true water tight seal because the hatch cover is going to flex, you can slow the water intrusion down but it will not stop. To be water tight, I am afraid that you are going to need more then one latch per hatch, especially without a sealing lip.. :cry:
Keep strokin! Absolutely fantastic progress!!! :salut: :salut:
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Thanks everyone for the suggestions and links. I really didn't want toe stubbers all over my deck so I probably shouldn't have gone so crazy with hatches. It all makes sense and I will add hinges. I will countersink them so they sit flush with the surface instead of using piano hinges.
CLM65 thanks for the link on the installed Taco latch too. I searched Google images and couldn't find any pics installed. Looks perfect and clean.
I ordered some rubber weatherstripping from eBay and will try that as a hatch seal. Planning on building the 2 smallest hatches this weekend for a test fit and will post pics.
Started fairing with a longboard and sanding block last night. I feel like the fairing compound made the floor more uneven than the glass under it. Feeling like I created way too much extra work that wasn't needed. Any tips or tricks for fairing I should know about?
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IMO no hinges is a mistake. Every time you open a hatch you will need to place the hatch down on the deck which is a safety issue. Not only the hatch itself lying on the deck but the opening as well is a safety issue.
Piano hinges are an option, personally I'd go with these;
http://www.foreandaftmarine.com/AC-713.htm (http://www.foreandaftmarine.com/AC-713.htm)
That hinge looks awesome, especially if you have enough room to lay the open hatch down flat on the deck. But will that type of hinge (with two hinge pins) allow you to get enough compression on a gasket to keep water out? I'm afraid that type of hinge would allow too much flexibility on the hinged side. I'm sure it would be fine if you have gutters and are not worried about where the water goes, but if you are looking for a water-tight seal would they work?
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IMO no hinges is a mistake. Every time you open a hatch you will need to place the hatch down on the deck which is a safety issue. Not only the hatch itself lying on the deck but the opening as well is a safety issue.
Piano hinges are an option, personally I'd go with these;
http://www.foreandaftmarine.com/AC-713.htm (http://www.foreandaftmarine.com/AC-713.htm)
That hinge looks awesome, especially if you have enough room to lay the open hatch down flat on the deck. But will that type of hinge (with two hinge pins) allow you to get enough compression on a gasket to keep water out? I'm afraid that type of hinge would allow too much flexibility on the hinged side. I'm sure it would be fine if you have gutters and are not worried about where the water goes, but if you are looking for a water-tight seal would they work?
Craig, great observation! I agree they will not work in the manner you describe and will flex. For what h2oryder wants to accomplish the piano hinges will be the best option. Although, even with a compression fit those hatches will be wet due to the fact that the openings do not have drip rails and are not plumbed.
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Depends on the outside fit. If its tight, and the cams are tight...shouldn't leak much if the deck drains and self-bails correctly.
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It took so much resin and 407 fairing compound to cover the floor, walls, bow seats. Long board fairing isn't too bad on the open flat spots but the tight spots and corners/edges are horrible and almost impossible.
407 filler is too hard so going to orbital sand down all compound (blocking is doing very little even with 60 grit) and try the notched trowel method with 410 micro light compound which I hope sands ALOT easier.
Anyone used the notched filler method and think it works better?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/fairing_compound.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7491&title=fairing-compound&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/notched_trowel.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7492&title=notched-trowel&cat=500)
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Looking good!
At this point...it is a function of materials used...or avoided.
Fair with easily sandable material in the putty mix. Microballoons, colloidical silica, etc.
Darn nice work!
:thumright:
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Hopefully you have one of these, they make life a bunch easier... :salut:
http://www.amazon.com/Ingersoll-IRT315-Piston-Straight-Sander/dp/B00004XOT5/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1371817245&sr=8-1&keywords=inline+sander
Sharp cabinet scrapers also work really well and fast. If you hold the scraper on a angle as you use it it will tend to smooth more evenly and grab less.
They can be bought relatively cheaply from Amazon or you can home make any shape you want from an old handsaw blade...
No matter what, you're looking at a heinous upper body workout! :salut:
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I picked up an inline sander this morning, thanks for pointing that out. I only have a 15 gallon compressor so not sure how it will work. Maybe it will give a few minutes of power before needing to refill my tank?
Started using a mouse sander for the corners and edges. Works pretty good at keeping joints sharp.
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That will be a little small for a compressor tank, but it will also depend on how rugged (CFM@90 psi) the compressor itself is.
No matter though, it will be a pile easier then long boarding. Really important to take the time to run through the numbers on grits, it will save you a bunch of time and effort.. If I am preaching to the choir, I apologize.
Small sections, good mask and killer tunes and all will be good! It will start out taking 4x the time you think is should but will speed up.
Farley said in a different post to change the paper when it stops cutting.. That is another seriously important thing to get the feel of because all you end up doing is generating heat and wasting time.
One of those abrasive stick cleaners such as http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=5518&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=&utm_content=pla&utm_campaign=PLA&gclid=CJWk3tz49bcCFYii4Aod2FMADw
is worth the money!! Just be careful on the inline that you don't slip with it, that's a damn good way to smash a knuckle.. Yes I did wanna cry a little when it happened :oops: :roll: ...
Sharp scrapers are the best for getting rid of sags, drips and runs.. It'd be the best $18 you spend.. http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=4898&site=ROCKLER
I am not pushing Rockler stuff, they just popped up first with Google.. :twisted:
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Thanks dburr. This is all new to me so any info helps!
Got all setup to use my new air inline sander but it was broken out of the box. Back to the store it goes.
2 days of manual blocking and having a lot of trouble knowing where I have sanded completely so I decided to use some Awlgrip 545 to help identify highs and lows. Probably have 2-3 layers of fairing compound to do to get this thing flat and nice. Overwhelmed by 22' of hull so going to break up the work and only do one section at a time until it is perfect, then move to the next.
Do I have to sand the 545 primer before putting more fairing compound over it? Does it need tooth from 80 grit or does primer already have tooth?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/primer.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7505&title=primer&cat=500)
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The majority of that primer will be sanded off, but yes scuff it all. If youre really looking for perfect consistent corners and whatnot make some different contoured blocks to sand em with, that jitterbug sander will leave dips and such. When I get close to final fairing sometimes ill mix some food coloring and denatured alcohol and mark the surface. Cheap n easy!
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Marking dips....many builders go with cheap black spray paint. Acetone bath when through.
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Notched troweling didn't really help. Just made the entire unfair surface higher. Filled the notches with more compound and tried to knock it all flat again.
Got some Rit Dye and denatured alcohol and going to try that so I can just spot fill lows.
Starting piling compound pretty high then using a batten (rigid metal ruler) to drag the surface flat. Seems to be the best method so far. I hope the bow is the tough part and the rest of the hull gets easier because patience is running thin
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Notched_troweling.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7519&title=notched-trowel-fairing-compound&cat=500)
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I'd suggest just some $.99 spray paint if you're sanding it all off. 545 is pretty expensive dust!
Also- while it looks great- dont forget your non-skid will help cover a lot of imperfections. Concentrate your detail sanding on the smooth painted areas.
Also the bigger sander you get (surface pad) the better "flat" surface you'll end up with. Try handing a light at the edge so it'll cast a shadow over any low points.
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IMO no hinges is a mistake. Every time you open a hatch you will need to place the hatch down on the deck which is a safety issue. Not only the hatch itself lying on the deck but the opening as well is a safety issue.
Piano hinges are an option, personally I'd go with these;
http://www.foreandaftmarine.com/AC-713.htm (http://www.foreandaftmarine.com/AC-713.htm)
That hinge looks awesome, especially if you have enough room to lay the open hatch down flat on the deck. But will that type of hinge (with two hinge pins) allow you to get enough compression on a gasket to keep water out? I'm afraid that type of hinge would allow too much flexibility on the hinged side. I'm sure it would be fine if you have gutters and are not worried about where the water goes, but if you are looking for a water-tight seal would they work?
Craig, great observation! I agree they will not work in the manner you describe and will flex. For what h2oryder wants to accomplish the piano hinges will be the best option. Although, even with a compression fit those hatches will be wet due to the fact that the openings do not have drip rails and are not plumbed.
FYI, I was curious about how those 180 degree (double pin) hinges would work and how much slop they have, so I picked up one from Gemlux. I must say that I am surprised at how little slop there actually is. The middle piece has little "ears" that pretty much keep the two halves of the hinge in alignment. Perhaps not as tight as normal hinges, but pretty close. The drawing for the Accon hinge in the link shows similar ears to the Gemlux, and it is about twice as expensive, so it may work even better. It is also 316 vs 304 SS.
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That hinge looks awesome, especially if you have enough room to lay the open hatch down flat on the deck. But will that type of hinge (with two hinge pins) allow you to get enough compression on a gasket to keep water out? I'm afraid that type of hinge would allow too much flexibility on the hinged side. I'm sure it would be fine if you have gutters and are not worried about where the water goes, but if you are looking for a water-tight seal would they work?[/quote]
Craig, great observation! I agree they will not work in the manner you describe and will flex. For what h2oryder wants to accomplish the piano hinges will be the best option. Although, even with a compression fit those hatches will be wet due to the fact that the openings do not have drip rails and are not plumbed.[/quote]
FYI, I was curious about how those 180 degree (double pin) hinges would work and how much slop they have, so I picked up one from Gemlux. I must say that I am surprised at how little slop there actually is. The middle piece has little "ears" that pretty much keep the two halves of the hinge in alignment. Perhaps not as tight as normal hinges, but pretty close. The drawing for the Accon hinge in the link shows similar ears to the Gemlux, and it is about twice as expensive, so it may work even better. It is also 316 vs 304 SS.[/quote]
Both are great products.
Before you purchase...check the Orcas hinges, pop-cleats, etc., available through manufacturers. You can search the web...however, the supply chain is closely held.
We were fortunate to source them. Will be happy to help via PM.
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They had a set of those hinges at West Marine so I played with them a little. They do look awesome but will flex and prevent a watertight seal. Stationary probably wouldn't be an issue but bouncing on some ruff water and they may lift or even constantly rattle.
Went with some SeaDog flush mount hinges instead ordered on the net. I'm happy with how they will look and they seem to be good quality.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/SeaDog_flushmount_hinges.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7531&title=seadog-flushmount-hinges&cat=500)
Got lots done this weekend. 4th coat of filler on bow followed by some Sherwin Williams SeaGuard high build primer (way cheaper than 545 and I get really good pricing on it). It is totally fair and only needs a few tiny touch ups where no Kiwi Grip will be. Hopefully will have the interior completely primed by the weekend.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Clown_car_bow_fairing.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7530&title=clown-car-bow-fairing&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/White_primer_bow.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7532&title=white-primer-bow&cat=500)
Gran PM sent
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Interior fully primed. Finished cutting and glassing all the hatches too for fairing and priming this week. All 13 latches and 22 hinges will be countersunk by the end of the week.
Just having everything all white makes it feel like so much of the hard part is over!
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Primered2.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7620&title=primered2&cat=500)
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Looks great!
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Been working on the hatch doors non stop for the past few weeks. Sanding between 3 coats of epoxy primer and now fighting Interlux Perfection.
Just sanded coat 4 of Interlux and think I have it figured out (using roll and tip method).
Paint looks perfect when I walk away from it but the next day it looks like it has sand all over it. It must be dust that is settling in my garage while the paint is curing. Time to build a makeshift paint booth in the garage?
I don't really mind fisheyes in the paint because most will be covered with kiwigrip but the dust creates little sharp peaks that look terrible.
Maybe propping up the hatch doors vertically while drying will reduce the area for dust to settle?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Hatch_lids.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7964&title=hatch-lids&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Dust_in_paint.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=7963&title=dust-in-interlux-perfection&cat=500)
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It must be dust that is settling in my garage while the paint is curing. Time to build a makeshift paint booth in the garage?
I can't speak for anywhere else but here in Tally Fla. it would look exactly the same.
Lots of airborne particulates, mostly pollen.(http://www.anchoredbygrace.com/smileys/smha.gif)
Booth might help. :idea:
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Kiwi will hide just about anything
I thought making 7 hatches was a lot of wrk lol
Capt Matt
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Made a 6'x6'x8' sealed paint booth in my garage with PVC and plastic sheeting. Worked great to keep the dust off the curing paint but the temp inside got too hot and the tipping didn't work and there are brush marks on all 13 hatches. Looks like they were painted with a wisk broom...so back to wet sanding and coat 6!
Can I run kiwigrip all the way to the edge of the hatches? Or do I need a smooth surface to help chanel water?
Was going to paint the exterior of the hull with Perfection but trashing that idea. Completely over that product.
Any other 2 part paints that can be rolled and tipped then wet sanded for the final coat on the hull??
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I planned on leaving a smooth area around the hatches and masked it out and painted it that way first. With the hatches not all exactly the same size it just did not look right so I went back and painted over to the edge of the hatches. It just made everything look more uniformed
Capt Matt
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Thanks Capt Matt
Do you have pics of your non-skid running all the way to the edges of the hatchs?
I just want to check it out before I go that route.
Called Interlux tech for help but coat 6 still has micro bubbles...back to sanding and coat 7!
Adding additional thinner right before painting helped reduce the size of the bubbles but it unacceptable to have this with such an expensive paint.
I'm painting in a sealed garage and have wet the walls and floor to control all dust. 70 degrees with 20% humidity. Using Interlux 2333N solvent and allowing 1 hr to flash off then tack cloth right before painting. Almost ideal working conditions.
Anyone have better luck with Pettit EZPoxy 2 two part urethane?
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Had the same issues with bubbles when varnishing until I started the coating as the shop cooled off for the day. If I coated in the morning, any trapped air would cause a surface bubble as the sun came up. It would happen after multiple coats too, so much for impermeability... :shock:
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Should be some pictures in the old rebuild thread
Next time I paint my boat it's with rustolium
Awl grip did not impress me either for the amount of money it cost
Capt Matt
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Interlux Perfection paint update:
Interlux has a bad batch of Snow White. Shelf life is max 2 years. Based on the numbers on the half gallon kit I purchased the "Base" paint was fine and within 1 year mfg but the "Cure" (hardner) was over 3 years old! They don't know how this happened since the half gallon kit is sold with the Cure inside a white plastic bucket attached to the top of the Base.
Just a heads up to anyone else who has Cure batch number MG1218UF
I purchased my Interlux Perfection from Overton's althought it was drop shipped directly from Interlux but other suppliers may have the same bad batch too.
Replaced by Interlux free of charge...although it took some pushing and I had to drive 70 miles to pick up a replacement from an authorized reseller.
Lets hope coat 8 goes better!
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H20
This may be old news for you and most others, but let me start by saying I'm relatively marine topcoat/paint CLUELESS. However, I do know from personal experience that air bubbles in finish coats can often be removed with a mild, clean heat source after the coating has been finished and before it kicks (i.e. hair dryer, heat gun, or VERY careful propane torching). I say this based on years of epoxy use for many coating purposes, but the principle for it's effectiveness should cross over to other coatings unless those specific coatings evaporate under mild heat...Expand the air bubble, make it pop, and allow the coat to level naturally around the popped bubble. Just a random suggestion since it sounds like you're having a TON of trouble with the finish. Sorry, and good luck, bro! :salut: Your work has been impressive so far.
Perhaps ask Interlux what they think or try it on a sample?? :scratch:
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Small bubbles in the finish sounds like solvent pop to me. It could be caused by a lot of things. In my experience though its usually caused by excessive film build.The top skins over not allowing the still curing paint beneath to off gas properly. I dont know if interlux makes one or not but a slower reducer should help. Or they might even have a slower speed catalyst. I spray a ton of lacquer and conversion varnish and I have run into solvent pop several times when the temps get up or if there is a breeze at all blowing across the work or if I try rushing things and build up a coat too fast. Make sure there are no lamps putting off excessive heat over the work as well.
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Thanks for the input Georgie and brianincc
The problem is definitely solvent pop. The bubbles make it to the surface but never actually pop. A light pass with a hair dryer doesn't help because it just skins the top of the paint faster trapping the bubble. I'm using the Interlux reducer 2333N per the tech at Interlux.
Coat 8 sucked again. I'm done with this. Wet sanding tonight then taking to someone with a paint booth/gun.
Neighbor gave me a Preval Sprayer and I tested some left over paint with it after rolling and tipping. $4 sprayer works better than my $40 badger hair brush.
Never been so frustrated working on this boat. I have a lot of respect for anyone who has rolled and tipped with Perfection and can get the "sprayed" finish look.
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Should be some pictures in the old rebuild thread
Next time I paint my boat it's with rustolium
Awl grip did not impress me either for the amount of money it cost
Capt Matt
are you serious about rustolium? i ask because i know people have been painting their cars with it.
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Just a couple pics of my custom outboard bracket made by A&J Marine in Miami. The positive floatation box had to be widened so the bolt flange surfaces would clear my stringers but still leaves room for trim tabs and new scupper holes. The platform is 70" wide and overall 16" tall with a 22" setback. I think it looks pretty awesome with an open transom and bracket for a full walk-thru transom.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/AJ_bracket.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=8149&title=a-amp-j-marine-outboard-bracket-with-kicker-mount&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/AJ_bracket2.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=8150&title=a-amp-j-marine-outboard-bracket-with-kicker-mount&cat=500)
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Looks similar to my old B-Bracket (without the handles on the sides). It had a folding ladder on the port side (underneath).
You're going to like it a lot. :thumright:
Good luck.
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Looks deluxe :thumright:
BTW, what are the smallest hatches in the sole for?
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My bracket has a mount for the under-ladder on the port side too just can't see it in the pics. I don't have the ladder yet tho $$$.
Ah good catch Rick. Those 2 little hatches are going to be access to the bottom of my T-top mounting plate bolts. I am planning on through bolting a top instead of just screwing it down. This was kind of an afterthough but the hull is divided into individual cells so I wanted access to each cell. There are also 2 large hidden screw out access ports inside the raised bow seating so I can access those cells too for cleaning of the bilge and inspection.
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Excellent choice on going with the floatation bracket, but then again I'm bias. Based on the height of the bracket I assume your motor is a 20" shaft.
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I think my engine is 25" but I can't remember for sure. I talked to the bracket builder upfront about this just in case I decide to swap out outboards at some point. They said a jack plate will work no problem on my bracket and I may want to add one no matter what just to have the ability to dial in the exact height I want for best performance. So 20" or 25" hopefully won't be an issue.
Marked the mounting holes and started drilling the transom. I was a bit nervous drilling holes in my new transom that took so long to build. Using a drill guide to make sure my holes are straight and it's looking good. Going to do a test mount tonight then hopefully painting the transom this weekend if the wind calms down.
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h20ryder, I can tell you with absolute certainty that the shaft of your motor dictates the construction of the bracket and the placement of the bracket on the transom. I can't imagine that the manufacture would have made you the bracket without knowing the shaft length of your motor. If the bracket is for a 20" shaft and your motor is a 25" shaft a jack plate will be your only recourse and that is if you properly mount the bracket at the correct height.
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Agree with Nando on the "look" of the bracket...I'd say for a 20". Right now, I'd stop what I'm doing, get that motor up to the mounting holes, and see where that LU falls...
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I know I measured the motor before placing the order for all of the dimensions to work so it must be a 20". I will roll the engine stand to the bracket and see where it sits.
What's the ideal location? Or what part of the motor should I be looking at lined up with what other area? I'm clueless here guys so any input will really help. Thanks
Also, I found the pic I had saved previously from Hermco on the Classic Sea Craft site with a jackplate on the bracket. Hermco is the poster so I'm sure he knows what he's doing.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Hermoc_outboard_bracket_with_jackplate.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=8157&title=hermoc-outboard-bracket-with-jackplate&cat=500)
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Hermco makes an excellent bracket, I would assume he asked the right questions. But, just to make certain, it will take a few steps, but it's not complicated.
First, move your engine over to the bracket to simulate hanging it. Almost all builders design their transom such that, bracket or no bracket, the engine is mounted in the 2nd hole down. So you need to approximate this.
Second, assuming the boat is on pretty level ground, make sure the motor is at totally neutral trim. That means your cav plate is the same distance from the keel, vertically, fore and aft on the plate. As long as you have the motor PRETTY close to it's installation position, measure from the floor to the leading edge of the plate, record that dimension. Mark on the floor where that dimension was taken from. Move the motor out of the way.
Third, get a straight edge (L-channel aluminum works great) that is long enough to secure to the hull bottom and will reach the engine location. Secure the straight edge to the hull bottom (this is a perfect 2 man job, get the wife to help you out!) adjacent and parallel to the keel.
Fourth, the easy part. From the mark you put on the floor, measure up to the straight edge. The rule of thumb with brackets is for every 12" of setback, you raise your motor 1". Since we want a cav plate basically level with the keel on a standard transom, a 24" setback bracket, you should see 2" of difference between the straight edge and the measurement of the cav plate you took earlier. 36" setback, 3" of difference.
Granted, since we are approximating here since the engine is on a stand, the measurements aren't going to be near exact...we're looking for "in the ballpark". What we ARE looking for is measurements that are WAY out. That will tell you A) whether the bracket was designed and fabbed for the proper motor shaft wise, and B) whether the bracket was installed at the proper height.
Hope this helps...
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Did the bracket manufacture not provide mounting instructions? I recommend giving them a ring.
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Just following along on this.
I received a mounting template with my bracket.
When I had my B-Bracket fabricated, I told the shop that I wanted the bracket mounted flush with the transom motor cutout. This was for a smooth transition between the splash well and the deck of the bracket.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/DSC_7651.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=4749&title=dsc-7651&cat=500)
The bracket maker told me the rule of 1" per 12" setback (as stated by SB) and designed the bracket to have the motor cav. plate mounted 2" (bracket was a 26" setback) higher than the line of the hull bottom when mounted at it's lowest position on the bracket. This would allow for adjustment higher up but not lower based on my 25" shaft length. When I questioned that design he stated that any lower would degrade performance. :|
I was fortunate that this was my first bracket and I was able to take the boat to the builder (sans engine) for him to measure. Great when it can be done but that often isn't the case so providing measurements would be critical for obtaining the best performance.
With a jack plate, you should be able to fine tune yours and hopefully obtain the performance you're looking for. I enjoyed mine a lot.
Good luck. :thumleft:
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CB, I HOPE you replaced that rigging hose... :shock:
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I'm not sure if it was but....
That was when I was cannibalizing the CCP and a member wanted the engine. He later purchased the hull also and I never took the motor off. Cutting that rigging hose was hard both mentally and physically. :cry:
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Thanks for all the info guys. I tried to roll the engine to the bracket but it almost tipped twice so I have to wait until I can get someone to help me. Its on a Harbor Freight engine stand and rolls well on smooth concrete but the rough aggregate stuff behind the boat keeps hanging up the wheels and starts to tip plus I have to make it over 2 freeze joints. No bueno.
I have some angle aluminum and will use that to get the measurement, great idea. Unfortunately my driveway is on a pretty decent downward slope so I will have to match the keel angle with the concrete angle by jacking the front of the trailer and go from there. I have one of those dial angle finders so that should help and hopefully I can get some pretty accurate measurements that way.
Bob your B-Bracket placement was really nice right at the height of the transom lip. I didn't really think of that on mine, wanted a little wave gate there which is how I chose my location but I'm sure yours was less likely to trip someone going in and out.
I followed the mounting instructions from the bracket builder: 3" up from keel, top of platform should be at 19" up from keel (16" tall float box) which is right where I'm at. They didn't give a mounting template so I made my own and all holes line up perfect. Drilled, test fit, overdrilled and chamfered, then filled with epoxy to be re-drilled.
Motor is a 20" I double checked this morn
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Evinrude.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=8158&title=evinrude-200-xp&cat=500)
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Might want to de-rig that motor... :wink:
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Bob your B-Bracket placement was really nice right at the height of the transom lip. I didn't really think of that on mine, wanted a little wave gate there which is how I chose my location but I'm sure yours was less likely to trip someone going in and out.
You are correct in your thoughts. The CCP transom had a splash gate behind it so mounting the bracket flush was doable without worrying about a following sea coming in. On the other hand with the bracket mounted flush, I did get at times a good amount water flowing into that rear splash well area.
You have the right idea for your transom cutout. I would have done the same too.
Good luck.
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I have never even started the engine. It came with the boat and the previous owner said "it runs perfect" so it must right?? We will see when the time comes. I did test the tilt yesterday and works fine, looks ugly on the outside but under the cowling is super clean and looks immaculate.
Here's a shot with the scuppers drilled. They may not be above water line but I'm using the ping pong ball style.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Drilled_transom.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=8159&title=drilled-transom&cat=500)
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If those are the scuppers for the self bail, it won't matter if they have a ball-check, they won't work if they are below water level. If they are pumped then they will. Sorry if I missed anything that answers that already.
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I didn't think of that. If the ball is already submerged it will float and block off draining. I hope it's above the waterline or I will have to mod it.
Floor was raised 1.75" during the rebuild and originally there was a drain chanel that dropped about 1" below the stock floor to the scuppers but since I never had it in the water I have no idea how it sat. My float box on the transom is 39" wide which is pretty big and gas tank and console were moved forward also. All batteries will be in the console too.
The new scuppers are 2.25" higher than the original ones. Used a drill guide to cut them perpendicular to the 12 degree deadrise so half the diameter is above/below the deck level.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/scupper_hole.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=8160&title=scupper-hole&cat=500)
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Well you won't have that inevitable 1/4" of standing water. :thumright:
What's the plan for the thru hull itself?
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Those scuppers look nice - huge - I hope they're above the waterline too. I will have the same question/hope on my rebuild soon too.
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I used a 2-3/4" hole saw for the scuppers. Overdrilled for filling with epoxy then PVC sleeve to match in inner diameter of ping-pong ball scupper. Just need to dremel the inner PVC flush with the deck.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Scuppers.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=8174&title=scuppers-sleeved-with-pvc&cat=500)
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:thumright:
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Anyone used kiwigrip on the vertical walls on the interior of their boat?
I have searched google images but not finding any pics.
Considering doing my interior walls to hide imperfections and prevent scratching/chips in the paint
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Anyone used kiwigrip on the vertical walls on the interior of their boat?
I have searched google images but not finding any pics.
Considering doing my interior walls to hide imperfections and prevent scratching/chips in the paint
The members' experience with Kiwigip is that it is good for a specific use, as a horizontal deck fill in the short term. Via flow and gravity, finds and fills seeps, weeps, and spider cracks. Although it is thick, goes on soft and wet.
Wouldn't run it up the hull sides. Vertical application could end up a mess. Could fall down/peel off in sheets when the moisture gets behind it.
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Ditto what Scott said... The adhesion of that stuff is less than impressive. Know some commercial guys that swear by it, but they reapply all the time cuz it is easy with that stuff.
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Sounds like both you guys have heard issues with kiwigrip adhesion. Is there another non-skid that is better? Even if I don't use it on vertical surfaces?
I just rolled and tipped the 1st coat of Interlux Perfection onto my interior bow and hope to have all of the interior done and ready for non-skid by the end of the weekend.
Thanks
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Not really issues, its just a single part water based product, how good can it stick ya know..
If its imperfections youre trying to hide, I know my eye is drawn to a nice clean tape line on the deck way more than some small imperfections. Kinda hiding em right out in the open if that makes sense. Definitely wouldn't put it on the verticals...
I like the roll paint, diperse nonskid particles way of doing it myself..
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dirtwheels
I didn't know kiwigrip was water based but for sure that is off my list now.
I saw a boat in the dry storage area at my local harbor that has texture on all the interior vertical walls which is where I got the idea. I am probably going to be packing kayaks on the interior sometimes so I was looking for something tough that wouldn't get super beat up. Found out it is Line-X sprayed on coating. One of the guys told me about the coast guard boat down at the dock that has Durabak rolled all over it and those guys swear by it. In the water and in use non stop all year round and looks brand new.
Any thoughts on Durabak?
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That Line-x seems like good stuff, but pricey and cant DIY!
Never tried the Durabak stuff...
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Read soooo much info on Durabak, both good and bad experiences but I feel confident on the info I found and pulled the trigger on 2 gallons that should be delivered Friday. I am going to try to roll it this weekend on the interior vertical hull walls. We will see how it goes.
I just painted around my hatches with Interlux Perfection but need to tape off some of those areas to lay down the non-skid. Can I tape it off for non-skid just 3 days after application or is that likely to lift the paint when I pull the tape?
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Read soooo much info on Durabak, both good and bad experiences but I feel confident on the info I found and pulled the trigger on 2 gallons that should be delivered Friday. I am going to try to roll it this weekend on the interior vertical hull walls. We will see how it goes.
I just painted around my hatches with Interlux Perfection but need to tape off some of those areas to lay down the non-skid. Can I tape it off for non-skid just 3 days after application or is that likely to lift the paint when I pull the tape?
What is full cure time of the Perfection, and how was the surface prep before the Perfection was applied? Those will be your determining factors...
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Re the Durabak install:
Wipe her down good and heavy with acetone, especially on the verticals :thumright:
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While waiting for my Durabak to ship I decided to take the bottom paint off the boat. Two 10 hr days laying under the boat with an orbital sander but it's all off.
Ran into a little problem. When I originally brought the boat home after purchase I used a paint stripper that apparently had Methylene Chloride in it. Ate some of my gelcoat on the bottom and at the water line.
Do I need to grind off all of the gelcoat to bare glass now? Or just use a product like Interlux Watertite to fill the spots where the gelcoat came off?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Gelcoat.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=8895&title=gelcoat&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Gelcoat2.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=8896&title=gelcoat2&cat=500)
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Kinda tough to make a judgement from pics. Looks pretty thin. How much of the hull looks like that? If the gel isnt all crazed and whatnot you can go over it fine. The bond between the gel and mat layer is what id be concerned with.
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Are you planning on re- gelcoating? Or, are you painting?
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Here comes my advice and experience with Durabak and Kiwigrip since I have used both. I went with Durabak first and then Kiwigrip. Here is what I have found with both.
Durabak basically has no shelf life where Kiwigrip does. Once you break the seal on Durabak the "clock is ticking". Durabak dries very quickly when putting down. Durabak is not very thick so you will need 2 coats at a minimum. Chances are, when you seal up the container with left over Durabak, it will be rock hard within 2 or 3 days. This basically ends your chance to go back and touch up later unless you have a container that the seal has not been broken.
The Durabak will look great at first, but you will find over time that it stains very easy and is almost impossible to keep clean. Also, if you are trying to hide any deck imperfections, they will show back up after a little time.
I ground down the Durabak the best I could and went over it with Kiwigrip. Yes, Kiwigrip is water based and makes clean up a breeze. Kiwigrip is thick like gelcoat so it will do a great job sealing and covering any deck imperfections. The shelf life of Kiwigrip is great from what I have seen. I popped open the gallon container that I used 6 months ago. It has not dried up at all. That will allow me to go back and touch up if I need to in the future.
The main advantage with Kiwigrip is with the special roller they send you, you can control how "aggressive" you want it to be. It does not have the rubber particles in it like Durabak has.
When you ordered the Durabak did you get the smooth or textured? The reason why is I would suggest that you put down the textured coat first and then follow it with a smooth coat. This will make it less aggressive and a little easier to keep clean.
In summary, I have found Kiwigrip to be far superior to Durabak. My deck looks and has held up so much better with Kiwigrip versus Durabak. I would personally send the Durabak back and go with Kiwigrip.
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Thanks JD - this kind of info is what CAS is all about - real life feedback from someone who has "been there - done that" :salut: I was a bit of a Duraback fan based on commercial use, but I would probably go to Kiwigrip based on your experience. :thumleft:
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Ended up sanding down the gelcoat area that had the crazing. The gelcoat is really thin on the bottom by the bow. Bought a West System book about crazing and gelcoat so following the info on grinding out cracks, wiping with alcohol, and filling with epoxy filler.
Planning on painting the boat with Awlgrip instead of gelcoating. Lots of epoxy hull repair so gelcoating is probably out.
Thanks for the info about your experience with Durabak JD.
I read your writeup about it on here and on THT. Sounded/looked like it was having issues cracking because the surface below it was cracking. My entire interior is brand new and I didn't think I would have to worry about that. Found a couple other write ups about the best way to clean Durabak but I know if I am not careful it will stain for sure. I may end up doing Kiwigrip on floor and cap with Durabak just on the hull vertical walls. There are so many good and bad reviews about every non-skid on the web it can make your head spin.
Got 2 gallons of textured and one quart of smooth per recommendation of the guys at Durabak. They said once I lay down 2 layers if I think it is too aggressive just roll a smooth coat over it.
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Ended up sanding down the gelcoat area that had the crazing. The gelcoat is really thin on the bottom by the bow. Bought a West System book about crazing and gelcoat so following the info on grinding out cracks, wiping with alcohol, and filling with epoxy filler.
Planning on painting the boat with Awlgrip instead of gelcoating. Lots of epoxy hull repair so gelcoating is probably out.
Thanks for the info about your experience with Durabak JD.
I read your writeup about it on here and on THT. Sounded/looked like it was having issues cracking because the surface below it was cracking. My entire interior is brand new and I didn't think I would have to worry about that. Found a couple other write ups about the best way to clean Durabak but I know if I am not careful it will stain for sure. I may end up doing Kiwigrip on floor and cap with Durabak just on the hull vertical walls. There are so many good and bad reviews about every non-skid on the web it can make your head spin.
Got 2 gallons of textured and one quart of smooth per recommendation of the guys at Durabak. They said once I lay down 2 layers if I think it is too aggressive just roll a smooth coat over it.
I personally think you will be much happier with Kiwigrip especially since you have a "fresh canvas" to work with. Whichever you decide, let me know and I could most likely give you some tips for putting down.
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Finally got around to taking the cap off. Made a template of all the old core before cutting it out since it was totally rotten. Layed a fresh layer of 1708 and ran a 3/4" PVC conduit wire run. Used my templates to cut out new 1/2" ACX for the new core which will be sealed with some 10oz glass.
Also started rigging my console.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Cap.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9043&title=cap&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Console.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9044&title=console&cat=500)
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Very nice. :thumright:
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That's a big ole console :thumleft:
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Everything looks great. Like the bulkhead mount compass too :thumright:
On the Morse...would go ahead and put a good coat of wax on it and leave it on, even though its inside. Was pretty shocked how quickly it began the pitting process.
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Yup console is pretty big. Designed around sitting on my Dometic SeaLand 975 throne. I'm 6'2" and I still have to hunch a little to fit.
Thanks gran, good suggestion on the wax especially since it isn't a real Morse (ebay copy). Just carnauba wax?
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1/2" ACX core installed and glassed. Routed all edges so 10oz glass would roll over the edges smoothly. Time to flip it and put it back on the boat.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Cap-recored.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9088&title=cap-recored&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Cap-recore2.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9087&title=cap-recore2&cat=500)
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Sweet :salut: :salut: :salut:
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Top cap is back on the boat. 100 new stainless #14 truss head screws with fender washers and nylon lock nuts. Also grinded every single old screw hole in the cap and filled with thickened 406 West System. Sanded fair then rolled Sea Hawk epoxy high build primer.
Hull had some bad spider cracks along the keel along with a big flat spot from beaching. Grinded back 5' of the gelcoat and glass until cracks were gone then layed 3 layers of overlapping 1708. Also grinded back all 3 of the bow eye locations and reglassed with 4 layers of 1708.
Using a dremel with small sanding wheel to grind out every single gel coat blister no matter how small. Swiss cheese hull!
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Top_cap_sanded.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9323&title=top-cap-sanded-and-faired&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Keel_repair.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9321&title=bow-eye-and-keel-repair&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Keel_repair2.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9322&title=keel-fiberglass-repair&cat=500)
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Wow, looks/sounds like you've been busy :thumleft:
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Wow, looks/sounds like you've been busy :thumleft:
X2
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Wiped the hull with denatured alcohol tinted with Dykem then longboarded 3/4 of hull to prep for primer but ran into a question:
Where the exterior hull sides meet the transom there is an inward curve on both port and starboard sides. The longboard spans the indentation with about a 1/8" gap (red line). Is this normal and part of the original hull shape? Are all 22-2 like this? Or do I need to use filler to build this up so the indentation is gone?
Sorry, having difficulty describing this so I made the attached diagram to illustrate.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/photo_2-2.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9373&title=photo-2-2&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/photo_35.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9374&title=photo-35&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/HULL.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9375&title=hull&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/photo_1-2.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9372&title=photo-1-2&cat=500)
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I'm not sure I would worry about that little bit. No one will ever see it but you.
Nice job on the sanding though :salut:
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Im with Rick on this one. But wet the hull with a water hose to get it glossy n shiny and look down the side and see how much it bothers you. If you cant live with it by all means fill it...
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Thanks guys. I wet the hull and really don't like the way it bends there so I will fill it and longboard it today and tomorrow. Then on to barrier coating the bottom. Plan is to have the entire paint done by end of April.
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dood your doing an amazing job! I hope mine turns out half as good as yours! cant wait to see what the finished product looks like!
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I'm with the others - don't worry about it. I can't imagine anyone will notice it with a naked eye.
Question on the Dykem blue...does that affect the adhesion of gel coal in any way? Do you need to fully remove it, either by sanding or by chemical means, before gel?
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dood your doing an amazing job! I hope mine turns out half as good as yours! cant wait to see what the finished product looks like!
Thanks. Can't wait to finish the body work and get mine painted. I really considered a gray color like your boat before finally settling on seafoam green. Your boat looks great.
I'm with the others - don't worry about it. I can't imagine anyone will notice it with a naked eye.
Question on the Dykem blue...does that affect the adhesion of gel coal in any way? Do you need to fully remove it, either by sanding or by chemical means, before gel?
I already added 2 layers of filler and started longboarding it. I want the body perfect after all the hard work I put into the inside. I learned about the Dykem from reading a post from Raybo on the process they use to prep for paint. The results they accomplish are amazing. It never stated anything about removing the Dykem at the end but the last coat of primer won't get dye. They were painting with 2 part LP paint tho and not shooting gel for that specific boat so I don't know if dye only works for painted hulls vs gelcoat.
One thing I really liked with the Dykem and denatured alcohol was that it is so thin is seeps into any tiny crack and then highlights blisters or gelcoat cracks that need to be ground out and repaired.
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The hull was probably like that from day one. Keep in mind they just pop the hull out of the mold and it's nice and shiny... It probably came out of the mold nice and hot and not fully cured and she warped a bit. No biggie. But it sounds like your going to have a beautiful boat when your done.
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I already added 2 layers of filler and started longboarding it. I want the body perfect after all the hard work I put into the inside. I learned about the Dykem from reading a post from Raybo on the process they use to prep for paint. The results they accomplish are amazing. It never stated anything about removing the Dykem at the end but the last coat of primer won't get dye. They were painting with 2 part LP paint tho and not shooting gel for that specific boat so I don't know if dye only works for painted hulls vs gelcoat.
One thing I really liked with the Dykem and denatured alcohol was that it is so thin is seeps into any tiny crack and then highlights blisters or gelcoat cracks that need to be ground out and repaired.
I'm sure it is going to look great. I am a long ways from painting, but right now I'm torn between white and seafoam green, so I am looking forward to seeing yours.
I think I saw a post a while back on a rebuild Eugene was doing (Ashley's maybe?) where he used the Dykem blue and then gelcoat. I'll have to give him a call and get the scoop.
One more question for you...what are you using for the longboarding?
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White is such a clean color and makes a rebuilt boat just look "new" to me but seafoam feels like a "classic" panga color. I am using AlexSeal seafoam which is a little different than other seafoams but since I am painting it myself I wanted a paint that can be buffed to hide any mistakes and that can be repaired and blended.
I have a bunch of longboards and blocks. For the hull I have been using a slightly flexible 24" long spruce strip I bought from Lowes that I made handles on from a 2x2. It was the perfect width for PSA paper and it hasn't seemed to warp at all and holds a nice steady even curve. Also have a K-block 9" Firm-Flex twinkie looking foam block that is great for the curvature at the top of the bow flair where it meets the rubrail. I made some other longboards too from thicker non-flexible wood for fairing the sole and console. For those I used a belt sander belt cut and adhesive sprayed onto them so I didn't have to change the paper. They stay sharp and just keep cutting.
Using Mirka Gold sticky paper in rolls. It cuts well and seems to outlast some others I tried, especially on cured epoxy resin.
I can post pictures of my longboards later if it will help.
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Long boards scare me...especially the 6 footers with 2 sets of handles. Gotta ply your buddy with a LOT of beer to get him to man the other set... :shock: :shock: :shock:
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Scares me too, Bob - seems like a lot of work! I will be getting a line sander soon, but I'm not sure if that is really a replacement for a large longboard.
If you don't mind posting the pics of the longboards, I would love to see them. Thanks!
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Push -Pull.... No I meant Pull- Push!
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/2_man_longboard.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9421&title=2-man-longboard&cat=500)
These look pretty cool too!
http://flexicat-usa.com/index.php (http://flexicat-usa.com/index.php)
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Long board porn would be great. :mrgreen:
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Lewis that Flexcat is the cats meow! Holy cow! It's like a giant windshield wiper.
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I saw a video of a guy using the flexcat to apply fairing compound and sand at a tradeshow on YouTube. It is pretty deluxe!
I have an inline sander too (Ingersol Rand) but I don't really use it because it doesn't flex and I want the curves smooth.
Here are my homemade boards and a few store bought sanding blocks. The one on the very far left is laminated foam from a laptop box I had at work. Its firm but really bends smoothly since each layer of foam is fighting the other (for 220-320 only).
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/photo-10.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9422&title=sanding-fairing-longboards&cat=500)
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Nice collection! Looks like some DIY longboards are in my future! I had made one a few years back with 1/4" plywood when I made a cedar strip kayak. Worked great, but I eventually asked too much of it and it broke. I'll use a little thicker wood this time and see how it goes. Thanks for the picks!
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You guys are gluttons for punishment... :shock: :wink:
When I was at Stamas, our 2 "prototype" guys used to man the 6 footer. Always fun watching them when they got out of sync!! Just like the pic and comment Lewis posted earlier...
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Another concept I have been working on after I saw a yacht magazine with a fold down transom swim step on a sail boat. Started sketching up a wave gate that is hinged and would act as an inward ramp for walking out to the outboard platform. Best of both worlds, closed transom for following seas or rough water, or open when spearfishing for getting back into the boat from the water. It's like a massive tuna door.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Wave_gate_positions.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9469&title=transom-wave-gate&cat=500)
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Last weekend ground out close to 500 small gelcoat cracks with a dremel that I thought might be blisters on the bottom. Wet out each one to saturate the dry glass then filled with thickened epoxy and sanded the entire bottom fair again. Last night finished rolling and tipping 4 coats of West System epoxy with 422 Barrier Coat additive. Last coat went on pretty thick since temps were dropping at 11pm.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/WestSystemBarrierCoat422.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9486&title=west-system-barrier-coat-422&cat=500)
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Not too shabby :salut:
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Filled all the pin holes and any other little indentation with Interlux Watertite epoxy putty then lightly sanded the entire bottom with 80 grit to add tooth for bottom paint. Rolled and tipped 4 coats of Interlux VC Performance epoxy over 14 hours. It rolls on really thin but gels in seconds to a much thicker layer. It kicks so fast the bugs don't even have a chance to stick.
Now on to power buffing to knock down the stipple and brush marks with a DA and some heavy cutting compound.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/VC_Performance_Epoxy2.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9517&title=vc-performance-epoxy2&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/VC_Performance_Epoxy.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9516&title=vc-performance-epoxy&cat=500)
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I have spent a few weeks under my boat sanding and fairing.... when everything is said and done yours should look great.
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Hull sides guide coated with Denatured Alcohol and Dykem. Longboarded with 80 grit. Lows filled with Watertight. Just finished rolling and tipping 2 layers of Seahawk high build epoxy primer. On to longboarding with 220 followed by a coat of Awlgrip 545 primer and then hopefully final sanding with 320 or 400.
Is 400 too fine for finish sanding before paint?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Hull_primed.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9541&title=hull-primed&cat=500)
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Damn. :thumright:
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Damn. :thumright:
Kinda sorta, CB... :shock:
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Sorry, I just have a physical affliction some men lose with age for CCPs.
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Another concept I have been working on after I saw a yacht magazine with a fold down transom swim step on a sail boat. Started sketching up a wave gate that is hinged and would act as an inward ramp for walking out to the outboard platform. Best of both worlds, closed transom for following seas or rough water, or open when spearfishing for getting back into the boat from the water. It's like a massive tuna door.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Wave_gate_positions.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9469&title=transom-wave-gate&cat=500)
Very nice. You could also rig up some fold-down or inserted "legs"....and use it as a seat.
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Another concept I have been working on after I saw a yacht magazine with a fold down transom swim step on a sail boat. Started sketching up a wave gate that is hinged and would act as an inward ramp for walking out to the outboard platform. Best of both worlds, closed transom for following seas or rough water, or open when spearfishing for getting back into the boat from the water. It's like a massive tuna door.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Wave_gate_positions.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9469&title=transom-wave-gate&cat=500)
If you did that, how would you account for rigging of the motor? Would you have a rigging tube built into the bracket? :scratch:
Upon thinking of that with fly by wire and hydro steer, that would be awesome :afro:
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Adding fold down legs to the transom wave gate to make it into a seat is a great idea, thanks Gran. I'll start woriking on that design next.
86Aqua
There is enough room between the transom cut out and the swim platform to allow the rigging to run through just above the bracket. I think I have 5.5" so hopefully that will be enough if I use a 2" rigging tube/flange. I am using hydo steering (SeaStar) but not sure about the throttle/shift cables yet. What is "fly by wire"?
Buffing the brush marks out of the bottom VC Performance didn't work at all. Eneded up resanding the entire bottom with 220 grit for another final coat that will be thinned and tipped with a better brush. Tired of laying on the ground under the boat!
Also got half way done longboarding the sides with 220.
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Finished block sanding enitre hull with 320 grit so the Awlgrip 545 primer is smooth.
Top cap has 6 coats of Alexseal Snow White rolled on and cured for a week.
Rolled 1st coat of Alexseal Seafoam Green on hull sides but noticed a few pinholes.
How do I fill pinholes once paint is applied? Mix some paint with cabosil? Or do I need to use something like Watertite epoxy filler?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/roll_and_tip.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9652&title=alexseal-seafoam-green-roll-and-tip&cat=500)
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Just need to wet sand and buff
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Hull_painted.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9914&title=hull-painted&cat=500)
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That is just......... WOW!!! No need to do any upper body at the gym either after all that 'boarding! :salut:
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Beautiful!
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I thought the arm and shoulder pain was done but block wet sanding by hand is so far the best method for removing orange peel. AlexSeal 501 is extremely hard paint! Happy with the way it is turning out tho
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Hull_side_closeup.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=9968&title=hull-side-closeup&cat=500)
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That is spot on :thumright: I've seen body shops that can't get metal that smooth...looks great..What did you wind up doing about the pinholes?
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Longboarding in the prep was well worth the end result. Ended up filling the pinholes with the same paint. Just spread some a bit thicker on some plexiglass and let it gel for a few hours then used a squeegee to force it in. 5 more coats of paint on top for a total of 10 coats! Probably wetsand off 3 coats in orange peel.
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Boat hit the water yesterday for the 1st time. Floats with a bone dry bilge and loaded with 3 guys, full tank of gas, and ice the scuppers were just above the waterline and floors stayed dry all day. Sold the Durabak and ended up going with kiwigrip and really happy with the way it turned out.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Boat_back.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=10193&title=boat-back&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Boat_front.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=10194&title=boat-front&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Boat_inside_kiwigrip.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=10197&title=boat-inside-kiwigrip&cat=500)
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Beautiful! One if these days I am going to have to swing by and take a look.
Congrats on the launch.
DaveB.
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that thing is gorgeous. awesome job. getting a ttop on her?
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Very nice :salut:
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Absolutely deluxe!! Congrats on the splash! :cheers:
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Thanks guys. I am so stoked on the finished product. Without this site and advice from so many people here it would never have been possible. 2+ years and so many hours of labor but worth every second.
The funny part is our max speed for the day was 18mph with a 200hp motor. Still figuring out the motor but hopefully this weekend will figure it all out. I have no idea what the motor should sound like at high RPM but tach says 6,000 and speed is 18mph so something is off! Never plained off but didn't want to push it any further on RPM. Back of gauge is adjusted for "3P 6C" based on my google searches but maybe I'm barely opening her up. Such a rookie!
Floated through some skinny reefs I usually surf a lot and snagged a bunch of Calico Bass on 1st day so it was perfect.
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You've got tuna and tails in your backyard a stones throw from the beach. Get out and get into some of the great "offshore" action happening right now!
DaveB.
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Thanks guys. I am so stoked on the finished product. Without this site and advice from so many people here it would never have been possible. 2+ years and so many hours of labor but worth every second.
The funny part is our max speed for the day was 18mph with a 200hp motor. Still figuring out the motor but hopefully this weekend will figure it all out. I have no idea what the motor should sound like at high RPM but tach says 6,000 and speed is 18mph so something is off! Never plained off but didn't want to push it any further on RPM. Back of gauge is adjusted for "3P 6C" based on my google searches but maybe I'm barely opening her up. Such a rookie!
Floated through some skinny reefs I usually surf a lot and snagged a bunch of Calico Bass on 1st day so it was perfect.
Please take a pic from the back and show us where the engine is set in relation to the hull. If you could put a long 2 X 4 on the horizontal from the base of the hull "V" to beneath the cavitation plate, that will be of help. Thanks!
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ya something is up there. what size/pitch prop are you running? even if the motor is buried in the water it would run alot faster than 18mph at 6k rpm. pick up a cheap tiny tach or any other cheap tach and hook it up to compare rpm readings with your gauge. compression good across the board on the motor?
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I have another tach and it was showing the same RPM but the settings on the back were the same "3P 6C." Picked up a new timing light with digital RPM readings so going to run the motor on the hose tonight and see if that matches the tachs.
Prop is an aluminum 15" x 17 pitch 3 blade. It came with the motor and is in good shape (no dings or chunks missing).
Followed the 1" up for every 1' back rule with the engine bracket using a piece of angle iron along the keel for measurement. The ventilation plate was actually 2.25" up from the keel but I took the below pic while running. It was buried pretty good but we also weren't on plane yet.
Compression is even on all cylinders (87lbs). Had to replace power pack, rectifier, and all new plugs and wires too. Overall it runs great.
?
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Engine_placement2.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=10199&title=engine-placement2&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Engine_placement.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=10198&title=engine-placement&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Motor.jpg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=10196&title=motor&cat=500)
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Excellent job on the report.
I'm going to get in touch with Nando, he runs a 19-6 with a bracket.
Hang tight....something's funny here.
PS...what is that piece of metal under the bracket?
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Hub slipping/damaged on the prop?
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PS...what is that piece of metal under the bracket?
Side scan transducer????
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Bracket has 2 holes for extra adjustability and motor has 4 holes. I should be able to move it a lot if needed.
Piece of metal under bracket is the transducer for my StructureScan. It's big but awesome.
What do I look for on the prop hub to know if its damaged? Will take a pic tonight.
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What do I look for on the prop hub to know if its damaged? Will take a pic tonight.
Don't know that you can "see it" but you could try marking the hub and the prop (paint) and trying it. If they don't line up, bingo.
Trying another prop (if available) would be a better (easier) and see if that helps. Doesn't need to be the exact dia/pitch, just something to indicate a bad prop. Do you have access to another of any size that will fit?
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Unfortunately no access to other props. All the local shops want to sell me one and then can "change to a different one for free if it doesn't work."
All props on Craigslist here locally are expensive just for a test prop.
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H2Oryder here are my thoughts
1) have you contacted the tach manufacture for the correct setting on the tach?
2) as Capt. Bob stated, hub slipping
3) 6000 RPMs regardless of speed is high for the motor, I believe you should be at 5400 / 5500 for that OMC motor
4) 17' pitch seems small for that boat. If you can confirm the setting with the tach manufacture and can also confirm no hub slippage, you're going to need a larger pitch prop.
5) regarding motor height, what is the setback on your bracket? My bracket has a 30" setback and my cavitation plate is 2 1/2 inches above the bottom of the boat.
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Just speculation, but my concern looking at the size/position of the transducer....when she squats to get on plane the prop may not be getting clean water due to the 'ducer. Frothy water, spinning in air/water and revving up, not biting.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/Motor.jpg)
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Sounds viable Gran.
As said earlier - you want smooth water for the 'ducer and the motor needs pure water to stay cool and also bite. Maybe that 'ducer would work great without a bracket because the water pickups are not far from the ducer. I think it is beating up the water too much before pickups. Almost looks like a planer.
My $.01
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Exactly.
The more I look at that pic....the water is aerated in a pretty large area.
As a test, pull the 'ducer (or tape it on top of the bracket) and run her. If that's the culprit, you'll know on the first hole shot.
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H2Oryder here are my thoughts
1) have you contacted the tach manufacture for the correct setting on the tach?
2) as Capt. Bob stated, hub slipping
3) 6000 RPMs regardless of speed is high for the motor, I believe you should be at 5400 / 5500 for that OMC motor
4) 17' pitch seems small for that boat. If you can confirm the setting with the tach manufacture and can also confirm no hub slippage, you're going to need a larger pitch prop.
5) regarding motor height, what is the setback on your bracket? My bracket has a 30" setback and my cavitation plate is 2 1/2 inches above the bottom of the boat.
1) Just called Teleflex and they said setting for tach on the instruction sheet that came with the gauge is wrong and assumes I/O motor even though it says "Outboard." So now I need to move the setting to "6P." Did I really drive around all day at 1/5th throttle? Throttle cable needs to be adjusted too since it was almost all the way down.
2) Found the prop number I had noted on my phone. Its a 391200 15x17 which looks like a Michigan Wheel prop with a "pressed in bearing" if that makes any difference.
3) 6000 is really high and I didn't think it sounded like it was going that fast. Will know more tonight once I adjust tachs.
4) Probably going to buy another prop and use current as backup. Thinking a 14" with 21 pitch 4 blade.
5) Motor is setback 22"
Just speculation, but my concern looking at the size/position of the transducer....when she squats to get on plane the prop isn't getting clean water due to the 'ducer. Frothy water, spinning in air/water and revving up, not biting.
I can easily move the transducer if that is causing too much cavitation. That was the suggested location by Lowrance even with a bracket. But I was having the same problem even from sitting still 0mph so there really wasn't any turbulence yet I don't think. I can remove the transducer easily though to test.
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H2Oryder here are my thoughts
1) have you contacted the tach manufacture for the correct setting on the tach?
2) as Capt. Bob stated, hub slipping
3) 6000 RPMs regardless of speed is high for the motor, I believe you should be at 5400 / 5500 for that OMC motor
4) 17' pitch seems small for that boat. If you can confirm the setting with the tach manufacture and can also confirm no hub slippage, you're going to need a larger pitch prop.
5) regarding motor height, what is the setback on your bracket? My bracket has a 30" setback and my cavitation plate is 2 1/2 inches above the bottom of the boat.
1) Just called Teleflex and they said setting for tach on the instruction sheet that came with the gauge is wrong and assumes I/O motor even though it says "Outboard." So now I need to move the setting to "6P." Did I really drive around all day at 1/5th throttle? Throttle cable needs to be adjusted too since it was almost all the way down.
2) Found the prop number I had noted on my phone. Its a 391200 15x17 which looks like a Michigan Wheel prop with a "pressed in bearing" if that makes any difference.
3) 6000 is really high and I didn't think it sounded like it was going that fast. Will know more tonight once I adjust tachs.
4) Probably going to buy another prop and use current as backup. Thinking a 14" with 21 pitch 4 blade.
5) Motor is setback 22"
Do you have a water pressure gauge? If not, I high recommend one. At 22" setback @2.25" up may be a bit too high. I recommend running it once you get the tach sorted keeping an eye on the water pressure gauge and the tell tale. I'm running 19" pitch four blade on mine but my motor can run 6000 RPMs all day long, verify what the max RPMs are for your motor and try not to over rev.
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you also probably want a prop somewhere around 20-21 pitch. 17 will give you great hole shot but not much on the top end. unless rudes are just different. i bet you were just running low rpm due to tach setting or prop/hub is slipping as mentioned before.
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Here is what the back of the prop looks like. I didn't know the thrust washer comes off. Looks like it may be slipping but can't tell if it is melted hub rubber or just old grease balled up. Picking up a new 4 blade 21 pitch tomorrow.
Tach adjustment worked, cut RPMs in half. So there should be a ton more throttle left and will get it on plane this weekend and test with and without the transducer in the way to see if it is causing cavitation although it is off to one side of the prop (see pic)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/photo_2-5.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=10201&title=photo-2-5&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/photo_3-2.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=10202&title=photo-3-2&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/photo_1-5.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=10200&title=photo-1-5&cat=500)
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That shot from the back looks good. Change the prop like you were thinking....leave the 'ducer as it sits for now, it looks a whole lot different from this angle. May be that froth was coming from the 200 set a little too high as Nando alluded to.
Anyway...when you go run her....let the big dog eat :mrgreen: Throw her down straight out of the hole and see what you've got :thumright:
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there you go. good find.
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Maybe my good glass eye talking but that hub looks toasted to me.
Did it smell really bad, aka burnt rubber?
Good luck.
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that hub is completely toast. if it isnt spinning yet it will soon.
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My 2 cents - rehub that prop (relatively cheap) and run it. First, you will see if a spun prop is the source of your high rpm/low mph issue (most likely culprit IMO). Second, you can judge the performance with a known wheel size and pitch, and thus make the process of selecting the best match prop much easier.
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The hub on the old prop doesn't smell like burnt rubber and my local prop guy couldn't tell if these are balled up pieces of rubber from the hub or just grease balls.
I bought a new 4 blade 21 pitch and I can swap it out for another size for free. It's a bit of a hassle because I have to drive 30 minutes to get to the prop guy and he is closed on weekends. So I will test the 21 this weekend and then report back and see if another size may give better performance.
Old prop will be kept as a spare. Prop guy said he doesn't think it's spun or I wouldn't make it over 10mph usually and I was at a consistent 18mph at 6000 RPM (actually 3000 RPM).
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Tested the new 4 blade 21 pitch prop. Old prop was definitely spun and needs a rehub. Now running a consistent 30MPH at 3200RPM with 3 big guys, ice, full gas tank, and gear. Is that about normal for these hulls? Or what should I be aiming for?
Engine and new throttle cables still need some adjustment but anything over 30MPH and the hull started to bounce due to the waves so wasn't able to see WOT speeds. 12hr day 18 miles off shore and boat performed flawlessly with a nice dry ride.
Can't get the engine timing figured out though. Tried to match the dwell and advance to meet the settings listed in the factory manual but adjustment of the timer base and idle screws is a bit confusing. Time to take it to a pro I guess.
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Cruise RPM seems a little low. Hard to tell if you will be able to get to 5000 and above at WOT. I tried a 4 blade and could not get above 4500 rpms. If you can't get it above 5000 you are putting too much load on the motor and making it lug, even though the holeshot is great.
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I agree. If you can't reach the low to mid 5000's on that motor then it's too much prop. You will start fouling plugs if the motor has to constantly work too hard as well as compromise fuel efficiency
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Probably couldn't get more RPM because my throttle cable wasn't reaching the full extension on the lever at the motor. I have been adjusting the cable screw each time out to get more throw but then it sets the idle higher at the same time because it doesn't return all of the way in the opposite direction.
Hole shot wasn't great and I really don't need it to be super fast, would rather have better fuel economy. Would you suggest a 21 pitch 3 blade instead?
It planed nicely and is balanced well with the bow always down but what do you guys think of the bolt on hydrofoils?
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I ended up with a 3 blade 19 pitch that hooks up hard, cruises nice at 30 at 4000. WOT is 5500 to 5600. Don't put the fin on yet, try to remedy problems with prop first. Tabs are a better idea rather than the fin.
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Ok perfect. Picking up a 4 blade 19 pitch tomorrow for testing Thursday then maybe 3 blade 18 or 19 this weekend. Hopefully can get it dialed in. Will hold off on fin install too, one issue at a time.
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IMO the three blade will make the boat porpoise more. I recommend a stern lifting four blade with either a 19 or 17 pitch.
Also, did you move the fuel tank forward to offset the setback of the motor? If not you're going to need trim tabs to go along with the stern lifting prop.
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Boat doesn't seem to porpoise at all. Only reason I think I was getting some bounce at 30mph was the swell in the ocean. Heard the prop come out of the water on a few of the big rollers and also landed pretty rough on those so backed off the throttle a bit.
I did move the gas tank and console forward 18 inches in my build as well as having 3 group 31 batteries inside the console and a 72 quart cooler seat in front of the console.
Will report back Thurs eve after the test of the 4 blade 19 pitch
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My prop guy conviced me to try a 17 pitch 4 blade instead of the 19 based on the math. He actaully said I should go with a 15 but said I could try the 17 first. What a difference! Fast exceleration, more than 2x the horsepower, and on plane in about 5 seconds. Running at 32mph at 4,000rpm. Still had another inch and a half throw left in the throttle but the ocean wouldn't provide conditions that let me go any faster. Slapping on white caps at 32mph.
May try the 15 pitch 4 blade next week but the 17 is great.
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I'd load the boat up with your average load, then run to see what your max RPM is. If it is in the RPM band the you might be right with what you have.
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Finally got the prop all figured out. I am running the 17 as my every day prop but also have a 15 as my spare/backup. 15 runs good especially because this motor is WOT at 5000-6000 rpm but the 17 just feels a bit smoother with the boat all loaded up.
Also finished another project, the livewell or is it a baitwell? Not sure what the difference it.
Took a really tall old well and cut about 18" off the bottom to make it shorter so it could fit partially under the leaning post. Glassed on a new bottom and tabbed up the inside walls. Also made a custom top. Really tired of doing body work so painted it with kiwigrip to hide imperfections.
Plexiglass top and front window so I can see what's in it plus 2 overflow drains since my pump really cranks out some water. 52 gallons.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/photo_1-8.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=10307&title=photo-1-8&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/photo_2-8.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=10308&title=photo-2-8&cat=500)
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:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: That thing is SWWWWEEEET! Love the plexi window and how you shaped the top to have work space. Realllllly really nice.
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Cool looking well :salut:
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Very good.
It's like an aquarium. :thumleft:
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Very good.
It's like an aquarium. :thumleft:
Lol. Put some koi in there and hang out at the dock sippin martini's watching them swim. I'd say beers but that setup is too nice for beers.
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I love it! What thickness plexi did you use? And can you get a pic of the inside? I thought about doing that when I build mine, but I'm not sure how best to do it with a double wall livewell. i'd like to see how you did yours.
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I like it too, and really like the rear plexi :thumright:
And agree with Koz, martini's would be the way to fly. Definitely too nice for beers, even Sam Adams :flower:
Craig, how about you outer lip the inside wall, plexi recessed in....then just a matching opening(air) on the outer wall, finished with alum. or starboard trim?
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That might just work, Scotty. Still need to decide if I'm actually going to do it...I've got plenty of time to make that decision.
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Very good.
It's like an aquarium. :thumleft:
Lol. Put some koi in there and hang out at the dock sippin martini's watching them swim. I'd say beers but that setup is too nice for beers.
Ha martinis on my boat! Try Coors Light... or if I'm going fancy Pacifico :D
The plexi is 5/16 thick. Probably could be thicker but then I would have to special order. This is just Lexan with UV inhibitor found at Lowes so it won't turn yellow or brittle. Bolts are truss head with washers and nylon lock nuts on back. Didn't over tighten because plexi loves to crack.
I had to stagger the drains due to under floor structure but was able to use two 45 elbows to get them both side by side. Gotta make circular swim area for our mackerel that really like to swim into corners and die.
Inside is just extra 2" of plexi overlapping cutout edge. Put some 4000 UV all around it so it sandwiched and provided a replaceable seal once the plexi gets too scratched up.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/photo_1-9.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=10309&title=photo-1-9&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data//500/photo_2-9.JPG) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=10310&title=photo-2-9&cat=500)