Classic AquaSport
Aquasport Mechanicals - things that need a wrench, screwdriver or multimeter => Controls, Steering, and Trim Tabs => Topic started by: slvrlng on December 11, 2011, 06:00:01 PM
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Christmas came a little early! :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/new%20steering/birthdayducksandboat013.jpg)
My motor is a 94 Johnson 175 Oceanrunner. It has a boot that the harness and fuel line runs into on the port side of the motor. The boot is old and torn and won't stay in the cover it fits into. After getting the ram put on the bleed screw end on the port side snags the wire bundle and is going to be an issue when you swing the motor. Do you guys have a suggestion on making the bundle stand out more so this is not a problem? I will order a new boot tomorrow, which should help some but I am thinking some kind of cover to really make it get away from the ram.
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/new%20steering/birthdayducksandboat014.jpg)
I replaced the fuel line yesterday and when I bundle it back together with the wires it does help also but I don't think its quite enough.
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/new%20steering/birthdayducksandboat015.jpg)
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Give him a "blue pill" for a more erect presentation or maybe one of those "offshore" wire harness looms that completely encapsule the cables to keep them from getting hung up in the bleedscrew. Maybe a piece of molded (with bends) radiator hose or equivilent to help the harness ride over or clear the bleedscrew.
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Lewis,
Get some of the woven sleeve that Yam used to use for their rigging. Then do this. Bring the rigging straight out from the rigging port on the motor straight forward about 5-6 inches, with the motor turned hard to starboard (starboard as in steering direction, not the motor itself). Now, with your left hand, hold that 6 inch dimension, and bring the rigging below that dimension back to the transom in a gentle arc. You're basically creating a semi-circle with the rigging about 12-15 inches in diameter. Where the semi-circle meets the transom, that's where you want to secure the rigging, using an Adel clamp (cushioned aluminum works fine), just slightly larger then the rigging diameter, a #24 ought to do you...
The stiffness of the combined rigging will keep the shape of the semi-circle (and keep it off your bleeder fitting), and the #24 Adel will allow it some movement as you go hardover to hardover... :thumright:
Then use a couple more Adels to secure the rigging before it gets to the rigging boot on the side of the transom...
And shorten up that fuel line! Have it so, when secured, it matches the curvature of the rigging, yet allows you the room to prime comfortably. In a case like your setup, I'll secure the fuel hose to the rigging about 6 inches before and after the primer bulb...
OOPS, didn't think. In order to put any type of rigging sleeve on, you have to de-rig the motor. Might want to think about spiral-wrap...God, I hate that stuff!
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Nice work Lew, great thinking guys.
I'd go with the pill myself if had that type of dysfunction.
That way you eliminate a lot a frustration, disgust, etc. Or you could just go with the spiral wrap.
Hope this helps.
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Lewis
I love my U-flex steering, and the stainless on the ram is just sexy.
One thing that drove me crazy though was it uses a different size finish nut to hold the wheel on than the seastar did, Edson sells the insert for their finish nuts, I could not find a regular stainless finish nut that was the right size threads.
Capt Matt
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I agree Matt, I think it looks great! I have a destroyer wheel so the nut should not be an issue. I got the grommet for the motor ordered yesterday and should have it by Thursday. When I install it I will have to derig the motor anyway, shouldn't be too bad. The hardest part has been trying to find the loctite 545 for the threads here in Atlanta. I finally found it at Grainger but they wanted 50 bucks for 4 ml! :shock: I then called Uflex and told CS about my search and after hearing my story they are sending me enough for the project :cheers: . Thank you Uflex!!!!!!!!!
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Ok so I have made some progress! Last week I went by a dealer near here and told him about the issue. I then asked him if he had any boats with hydraulic steering on them. He sells mostly pontoons and G3 aluminum bass boats. He had a 18 footer with a F115 Yamaha using a Teleflex Baystar. As soon as I saw it I realized how to fix this problem. The Yamaha had the same issue with the controls, they drooped down onto the ram. What I hadn't thought of was how to run the lines. They ran out of the rigging hole and across the splashwell and then back to the ram. DUH!!!!!!! This way the controls slide over the lines and are protected from snagging on the bleed fittings. so i got busy today and with my sons awesome help (read small hands that can fit into rigging boots!) we got the lines pulled and connected. :cheers: I have not finished yet because when I enlarged the hole for the helm pump I found that over the last 28 years water has been leaking under every gauge and the helm and has rotted the core under them all. I got the core cut out around the helm and laminated a piece of marine ply under it for now so at least that will be ok for a while, but eventually I will have to pull the console up and recore the entire piece.
So now I need you guys advice. when I run the lines I would really like to have the starboard one run over the port one. Having it set up like this keeps it sliding right over the fittings. If I run it under the port one it has a little more tendency to catch the ends. So what do you think?
Overview of what I have now
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/new%20steering/newsteering001.jpg)
This is what I mean by running the starboard over the port.
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/new%20steering/newsteering004.jpg)
This is what it looks like when the starboard runs under the port.
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/new%20steering/newsteering005.jpg)
If you notice the mesh, I got it for free from a friend at Bass Pro. This has helped a little but I think if I get some spiral wrap like seabob said and put it right where the cables contact the lines I think I will be okay.
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Looks good Lew,Have you thought about covering the steering lines with the mesh? :scratch:
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Alright Lewis, here's how you get a neat look, and not have any interference issues.
First, take the starboard line off the tee (bleeder fitting), and back it off just a smidge (don't worry, it won't leak) so that it gives the starboard hose just a little bit of a rise. This will keep it off the port side fitting.
Now, bring the port side hose close to the starboard side hose without making to tight a bend (8" radius should do), ty-wrap them, then bring them inline with the other O/B rigging and ty wrap them to the rigging, all the way to the rigging port. Yes, that's where the excess hose will live, coil it up and deal with it later.
Now, bring the shift and throttle cables to the mid-point of the rigging sleeve, ty-wrap there, then once again ty-wrap all the way back into the rigging port with the rest of the rigging. Now you'll see how neat and functional it can be, yet not that intrusive into the cockpit...
Once you get all this done, a little neatening in the starboard aft box...you're good to go...
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Lewis
Looks cleaner with every new every picture. With the ty's everything will be nice and clean.
Capt Matt
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I think I understand Bob. So what is the best place to get the marine grade tie wraps other than Worst? Will the ones at Lowe's and HD work OK?
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Get the ty-raps that say UV or sunlight resistant. Usually black. Lowes or HD should have them.
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Get the ty-raps that say UV or sunlight resistant. Usually black. Lowes or HD should have them.
^^^^^^^^^^^
Wally World has them in the automotive electrical section, UV black, made in Flippin, Arkansas (home of Ranger Boats), and cheaper than HD/Lowes...
And for Scott's education, ^^^^^ means what JJ said...
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Wally World has them in the automotive electrical section, UV black, made in Flippin, Arkansas (home of Ranger Boats), and cheaper than HD/Lowes...
Cool. Never noticed. I will have to look for them. I'm getting low. I usually don't mess around much in Wal-Mart auto section unless I'm buying oil and filters.
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"What if you went to Wally World and it was closed?" -Clark Griswold.
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"What if you went to Wally World and it was closed?" -Clark Griswold.
Just strap dead grandma/aunt to the luggage rack of the QMFT (that's Queen Mother Family Truckster, to you uninitiated to "Vacation"), invite John Candy to breakfast at DD, and he'll open it up for you!
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Close Bob but I'm gonna have to call you on that one.... It's the Wagon Queen Family Truckster ! LOL Classic car salesmen scene: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTaTitRENDM
"Sorry folks, park's closed. Moose out front shoulda told ya. "
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"What if you went to Wally World and it was closed?" -Clark Griswold.
Since we're playing "remember that movie" :scratch:
Technically (since quotes are being used) it's Florida (not Wally World) but I'll default to CJ's mix of WalMart and Mr. Chase. :mrgreen:
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Close Bob but I'm gonna have to call you on that one.... It's the Wagon Queen Family Truckster ! LOL Classic car salesmen scene: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTaTitRENDM
"Sorry folks, park's closed. Moose out front shoulda told ya. "
I can see Candy in my mind saying that...
Hey, wing, I was young at the time, my buddies and I used to catch a good buzz and watch that movie (back when HBO would play it 10 times a week!), my buddy couls make up goofy names for chit that would have us rollin'!! Hence, the QMFT...
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Sooooo what the heck happened to this thread? :lol: :lol: Classic Griswald when the squirrel attacks him in Christmas vacation.
Okay so I played hooky this afternoon and got it finished and......... it works!
How did I do Bob? I tried to use your directions and this is as close as I can get.
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/new%20steering/newsteering001-1.jpg)
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/new%20steering/newsteering003-1.jpg)
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/new%20steering/newsteering005-1.jpg)
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/new%20steering/newsteering004-1.jpg)
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/new%20steering/newsteering002-1.jpg)
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Nice job, Lewis!! I'd leave it just the way it is. Yeah, you could wrap everything in spiral wrap, with break-outs where the fuel line, shift/throttle cables, and steering hoses exit the bundle, but spiral wrap is a PITA...so leave it just like it is!! :thumleft: :thumleft: :thumleft:
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What a nice job Lew!
Those darn Thread Derailing Masters...they're up to their old tricks :lol: :lol:
GREAT work, you too SB on the advice :rendeer:
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Nice work Lew... That's teamwork my friends... :salut:
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Derail? What derail?... :lol: :lol:
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Scott's been into the eggnog again. :drunken:
He thought this thread was about trains.
So in keeping with the "movie quotes" theme of this thread.
Lookin' good Lewis. :thumleft:
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^^^^^^^^^^^^^
:lol:
(SB taught me that)
:thumright:
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Good job! :salut:
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Done and ready to go fishing
Sweet
Capt Matt
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super job Lew! :salut:
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Clean as a Safeway chit'lin Lew! :thumleft:
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:thumright:
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Did somebody say squirrel ? ? ? ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jdyo4evwMxU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jdyo4evwMxU)
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Lew and Bridgette went to the lake today to run Slipaway....and EXCITEMENT is in the air :lol:
They will be home shortly, with videos...and EXCITEMENT :thumright:
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Yes we went for a cruise this afternoon. 60 degrees with a 5 to 10 mph wind out of the SW. At 40 mph it was a little chilly but the motor is running better and better every time we use it. All that new gas is cleaning out the carbon and we tried to burn some off today. The rpms have increased to 5200 into the wind and 5400 downwind. 44 mph downwind. I still haven't gotten this prop to ventilate, yet. 14 x 19. Anyway when we dropped it in I backed it off the trailer and steered out into the little cove. But I suddenly realized that I wasn't going out into the cove the stern was swinging towards the bank that runs out parallel to the ramp. WTH!!!! I look back at the motor and see that even though I had steered towards the cove and open water the motor was hard over towards the bank.
YES, I am a dumbazz!!!
I had put the hoses for the new steering on the wrong fittings. It steers backwards. Dammit man!!!
Once I figured this out I had a very quick learning curve on how to think backwards. If you want to go right you steer left. Holy Moly I cannot believe I did this. I quickly decided that what the heck I am already in the water and we might as well go for a ride. I will switch them out tomorrow and bleed it again so from now on it will be fine. I hope no one had a camera on me trying to load this thing. You know when your coming in and everything is lined up and a little gust of wind blows you just a touch off and you correct the drift but NO it goes the other way!!!!!! Took me about 15 times before I hit it right and we were able to get the heck out of there! Anyway, enjoy the videos and the pic.
We found one place that was 142 ft. Check out the fish suspended down about 75 ft.
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/Cruising%20on%20lake%20Lanier%201-6-2012/slipaway006.jpg)
I asked you if you were ready and you said yes!!!
http://s669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60 ... way002.mp4 (http://s669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/Cruising%20on%20lake%20Lanier%201-6-2012/?action=view¤t=slipaway002.mp4)
Motor just runs and runs!!!
http://s669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60 ... way001.mp4 (http://s669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/Cruising%20on%20lake%20Lanier%201-6-2012/?action=view¤t=slipaway001.mp4)
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Lewis,
Swap the lines at the helm, not the cylinder. You lose very little fluid that way, just have a rag or two handy to catch the leaks.
Top off the helm pump, take her out, see how the helm feels. I've done this many a time, most times a re-bleed is not necessary...
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I would but they were a pain in the butt to get on there. I need to bleed it anyway as I have not yet bled it after installation.
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I would but they were a pain in the butt to get on there. I need to bleed it anyway as I have not yet bled it after installation.
When you bleed, a little tip. After you've done one side, have a good flow of air free fluid, close the bleeder fitting, then, while holding the bottle upright, keep leaning on the relief valve (when you're hard over, the relief valve allows you to keep going, feels like you might break something but you won't), you'll see bubbles of air going back up the bleeder hose. Do the same to the other side. Once you feel she's good and bled, don't remove the bottle, but check your steering hardover to hardover several times. Ideally you want to see the motor move as soon as you move the wheel. If it doesn't, you'll need to bleed some more. Once you're satisfied, pull the bottle off, top off the helm, and you'll be food to go.
If over the course of usage, you feel any "jerkiness" (don't think that's a word, but whatever...), that's air and you'll have to re-bleed. The key is to take your time, and have Bridget help you, holding the catch jar at the cylinder. And remember, get your fluid at the airport!!
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Changed the hoses over today at the cylinder. I just didn't feel like playing a contortionist in and around the console. I had a very small amount of spillage and after rerouting the hoses and re-bundling them it seems to work like it should. I did not bleed them as it seemed to not have any issues when turning the wheel. No shuddering or hesitation at all. Time will tell. I am not sure if the Uflex system has a relief valve. I don't remember seeing one.
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Weather still decent over there tomorrow? You gonna try and hit the lake again?
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Looks like rain so probably not going tomorrow. We will be going up to the mountains to the father in laws place. He has a woodworking shop in his basement and I got him to make some new teak gunwale steps. I will have to sand the bottom of them to match the shear line but I found a really nice piece of teak with some awesome grain at a exotic wood importer near the house. They had one board that was about 1" thick and about 16 feet long and about 14 inches wide. That was a really nice chunk of wood!
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I don't even want to know what that piece of teak cost. I looked online a few years ago and a 1x6x6' was like $80 + shipping.
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I think the plug in the helm on the U-flex is vented, part of my problem was I had a vented plug at both helms.
Capt Matt
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Lewis, the relief valve is inside the helm pump. You won't see it, but when you go hardover and keep turning, you'll see you can continue to turn the wheel. That is the relief valve in action...
Capt. Matt, on dual station installs, the lower helm pump fill cap is replaced with a non-vented cap, the vented is at the upper helm. PITA to bleed dual station. You ought to try bleeding dual-station, dual cylinder! :shock: :shock:
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Seabob
Yeah thats how its hooked up now, My buddy has a portable steering pump that circulates the fluid, It comes in a tool box with 12V plugs to run the pump.One end atatches to the cylinder and one end to the helm You can watch the clear tubes as it circulates until all the air is gone from the system. Neat system I had never seen one before
Capt Matt
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Check out the teak step pads my father in law made. The best thing is if I leave them where they are now they fit flush. Now to sand and clean up the edges and then figure out what I will coat them with. I talked to gran and he said use some UV epoxy with awlclear on top. I just hate to use regular old spar varnish and it peel off next year. Capt Bob suggested a product to someone else a little while back but I can't remember the name. Was it Teak guard?
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/Teak%20Steps/newaulonacararubyredandteak019.jpg)
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/Teak%20Steps/newaulonacararubyredandteak021.jpg)
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/Teak%20Steps/newaulonacararubyredandteak024.jpg)
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/Teak%20Steps/newaulonacararubyredandteak022.jpg)
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those look great Lew!This interlux 2 part clear perfection works good and can be spot repaired http://www.yachtpaint.com/usa/diy/produ ... -plus.aspx (http://www.yachtpaint.com/usa/diy/products/varnishes/perfection-plus.aspx)
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Seabob
Yeah thats how its hooked up now, My buddy has a portable steering pump that circulates the fluid, It comes in a tool box with 12V plugs to run the pump.One end atatches to the cylinder and one end to the helm You can watch the clear tubes as it circulates until all the air is gone from the system. Neat system I had never seen one before
Capt Matt
Matt, that's Teleflex's PowerPurge Junior, great little device to have if you can spring for the grand or so they want for it!! We had one at PL, great for taking on the road. We had the regular purger at the plant...
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They look great Lew! The West with the UV hardener, then the Awlclear...only downside would be it may be too slick to step on.....oops......... :?
For the "Palm Beach" look.... they leave the washboards blonde. Lotta bleach.
The best thing is probably what you're thinking...go with something that still leaves the grain exposed a bit, so they can actually be used for the intended purpose.
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PS...for those of you interested in rubrail refurb...check out the "maestro" :salut:
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Deal I couldn't pass up, yeah its only a Seachoice but for 30 bucks its a no-brainer. Heck I was going to get a power knob for the old wheel and The Edsons are 80 and the Seachoice are 27. I got a whole new wheel with the knob for just over the price of the knob by itself. Now if it would quit raining long enough for me to go put it on!
(http://i669.photobucket.com/albums/vv60/Lewis55/New%20Wheel/wheel036.jpg)
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That's a beauty wheel Lewis!! I just installed an Edson on the Cape Horn...$300!!!
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Great deal on the wheel, I don't think the finish nut will fit the U-flex helm though, I had the same issue with both my edson wheel and my seachoice wheel. The U-flex threads are a funky size. I had to buy a finish nut and two plastic inserts from edson. I have a edson wheel on my lower station and only needed the insert for it. The edson finish nut and the two inserts were roughly $45 plus shipping. I just could not bring myself to spend $400 for another edson wheel yet . They are the best on the market so one day soon I will buy another one. Maybe you can find a generic finish nut that will take the insert
Good luck
Capt Matt
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Yeah its going to look nice on the console. This one came with 2 different finish nuts, Maybe the smaller one will fit. The one in the pic is a 5/8" -18 the other one is a 1/2"-20. He actually has another one just like it but he threw out a price for this one and I made him stick to it even after he looked it up in the catalog. I got the wheel cheap enough I also bought another winch for the trailer. 2000 lb 2 speed for 40 bucks. Another great deal. He has a bunch of stuff that he acquires from Land n Sea that doesn't have a box or parts are missing. If anybody needs anything cheap PM me and I will check with him and see if he has what you're looking for.
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I have had one on my flats boat for nearly 5 years. Still looks like new. I can't imagine paying for an Edson.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v53/Johnny_B/BackCountry/BackCountryApril2010_007-1.jpg)
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I have had one on my flats boat for nearly 5 years. Still looks like new. I can't imagine paying for an Edson.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v53/Johnny_B/BackCountry/BackCountryApril2010_007-1.jpg)
X2...
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My sechoice came with 2 finish nuts too, niether one fit, you can use the nut you have on right now till you get the right finish nut.
It drove me nuts!
Capt Matt