Classic AquaSport
Aquasport Model Rebuilds, Mods, Updates and Refreshes => Osprey Style Hull Rebuilds => Flatback 22-2 Rebuilds => Topic started by: Capt Matt on July 16, 2010, 08:17:47 PM
-
I began stripping my 69 flatback down the last few days. The cap is off, floor out and foam removed. Does anyone know how to remove the bedding compound on top of the stringers? I want to cut the tops off the stringers and re foam them as they are in good shape and not delaminated. All the foam that came out the boat was wet.
Any info would be great
Thanks
Matt
-
not sure myself, but would love to see some pics :cheers:
-
In looking at old posts, it seems the quickest way is just to grind the bedding compound off.
Messy, yes but quick. Is the stuff on top similar to concrete?
You could chisel it off but unless you're good with an air hammer I would be extremely careful.
-
Lew, think you're right....take a 40 grit pad and an angle grinder, and have at it. AND a respirator.
-
http://s836.photobucket.com/albums/zz28 ... g&newest=1 (http://s836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/?action=view¤t=S5000005.jpg&newest=1)
http://s836.photobucket.com/albums/zz28 ... g&newest=1 (http://s836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/?action=view¤t=S5000003.jpg&newest=1)
http://s836.photobucket.com/albums/zz28 ... g&newest=1 (http://s836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/?action=view¤t=S5000004.jpg&newest=1)
Here are the pictures of my project. Its in the early stages of stripping down but any info will be greatly appreiciated.
I have been following this site for a while and found this boat on here after about 3 months of looking for the right flatback to restore to be my new guide boat.
Thanks for the input
Matt
-
Started cutting the tops out of the stringers today, even though the foam looked dry on top it was wet underneath. Anyone have any idea's on how to cut the tops out of the side stringers that run against the hull? I'm worried about cutting the fiberglass mat tabs that hold the gunnel to the side stringers
Thanks
Matt
-
Started cutting the tops out of the stringers today, even though the foam looked dry on top it was wet underneath. Anyone have any idea's on how to cut the tops out of the side stringers that run against the hull? I'm worried about cutting the fiberglass mat tabs that hold the gunnel to the side stringers
Thanks
Matt
Matt,
Go ahead and cut the edge of that outer stringer with an angle grinder at a slight angle following the hull curve. If you are worried about interfering with the tabbing, don't be. Regardless you have to re-glass those stringers after re-foaming them. If it were my boat, after cleaning out all old wet material, id re-foam then I'd run a large strip of 2408 or multiple 1708, up 8" on the gunnels, down the gunnel, over the top of the stringer, down the stringer and onto the bottom of the hull at least 8" in one continuous run. Bring a friend and put a 4" paintbrush, large bubble buster and have gallons of resin ready, its gunna be a hell of a run!!!
-Chris
-
There you go Chris, throw the beef in there. So how wide do you reckon that first piece will be?
-
I'm going through what you're doing right now, just a few steps ahead of ya.
The bedding compound chipped off pretty easy, a lot easier than grinding it. I used a pry bar, put the curved end at the base of the compound & smacked it with a big hammer, sent big chunks flying but not as messy as a grinder.
I'm raising my floor about an inch so I cut the complete tops off my stringers, no reason to chip off all the compound in my case I just cut along the side of the stringer at the very top & will have to build about an inch of vertical wall before going across the top. Can't beat a sawzall for doin that.
To get the foam out I again used the sawzall with a long blade and carefully slid the blade between the foam & the stringer running down the length of the stringer, then cut across the foam about every 10 inches, letting the blade just barely tap the hull. Came back with the pry bar & took out big square chunks of wet foam, first piece was tricky but the rest popped right out. The blade didn't even leave a mark on the hull, just go slow.
I also cut the tops off the outer stringers & thought I'd be able to leave a little tab of the stringer still attached to the outer sides, but I wanted to wrap the new glass up the sides of the boat and the old tab ended up being in the way when I was trying to clean up the sides. I used the circular saw & cut about a little more than an inch off the vertical wall of the inner side, letting the guard rest on what was left of the deck to make a nice straight cut, then ground the remaining stringer tab off of the side & plan on gluing a strip of foam to the side to support the new glass.
Before foaming the stringers I ran a 3 inch wide tape strip along the inside wall of each stringer where they meet the hull, with about 1 inch on the hull & 2 inches on the stringer. From the factory they were only attached from the outside of the stringer. Just this one layer of tape made the stringer a lot stiffer.
-
There you go Chris, throw the beef in there. So how wide do you reckon that first piece will be?
Gran, id say that the piece would be approx 25"? Which would be perfect if you get 1708 in 50" roll. you get 2 layers with no waste. Can't beat that.
Capt matt,
A little advise. Instead of killing yourself and going back to your glass shop every week to get yards of material, do like I did, I bought an entire 209 lbs roll of it. Here was my savings 40 yrds 1708 cost me $440 dollasr OR by the 209# roll for $550. It is a no brainer. You get well over 125 yards on that roll. Just a suggestion. If you have left over, take it back to the shop and sell it back if you have that relationship with them or sell it on here!
-
I cut the tops off the stringers and have been pulling out all the foam. A sawzall saves alot of time just cutting long strips up and down the foam then pulling it out with a claw hammer and a pull bar. I'm about 3/4 done. Been so hot out just doing a few hours in the morning then a few before sunset.
Most of the flatbacks I look at online have had the middle stringer removed so a fuel tank will fit in the floor. Should I remove this whole stringer or just shorten it up? 5 stringers wide seems like overkill anyway. Looks like the bilge would drain better and be more accesable without the middle string too.
Thanks for your input
Matt
-
Most guys do remove the middle stringer - and the better rebuilds ad some bulkheads to tie the two innner stringers together at the front and rear of the tank - minimum.
-
Got the boat up on blocks and under a tent to make a little shade at least. I just cannot decide if I want to remove the old stringers and go again or refill them. Its the thought of refoaming and that foam getting wet again somewhere down the line. I think i can build a better stringer system than the stock pyramid style that I would need to raise up 2-3 inches anyway. With the boat almost totally gutted what are the advantages of saving the old stringers vs making new coosa board stringers and bulkheads?
thanks
Matt
-
Todays foam doesnt get waterlogged like yesterdays foam. A buddy of mine refoamed a Robalo some years ago and took a coring of the foam and put it in a sealed jar full of water and set it in his garage for 3 years completely submerged to see if it would absorb water and it never did! If there is no delamination of the stringer boxes, I would refoam the existing stringers. If you decide to make new ones you are going to have to make a jig superstructure to support the hull to keep it from flexing and folding once you remove the stringer "backbone". These boats had an excellent stringer system ahead of its time.
-
Looking at lots of other rebuilds I have yet to see any pictures that they have raised the floor after refoaming the original stringers. It seems it would be as easy to just build new ones
-
Matt, fill the original stringers then run a couple of layers of 1708 or 1808 biax across the fill holes. Then epoxy strips of coosa (or whatever you decide) on top of the original stringers. Then lay your sole on top. This is what I'm going to do on the 19-6. You can use plywood if you choose. Just seal it well. Epoxy excels at this as it has a secondary bond that poly doesn't.
If you don't think its high enough add another layer.
I agree with Fitz that the new foams are much, much better than the original.The new ones are closed cell and the old ones are open cell.
-
Its done: ripped all the stringers out. Have a little grinding to do but one more day and I should be able to get the inside sandblasted and be ready to start laying glass. There was so much wet foam under the stringers that i would have never been able to get out if I would have left them in. After reading so much about foam filled I'm over foam period. I most have removed 1200# plus of wet foam. The stringers came out easy with very few cuts as the tabs ripped right off the floor.
With how many hours I put on my boat I'm going to feel much better when she is in the water with brand new stringers and not a single piece of wood in the whole boat. After the transom comes out there will only be about 300 pounds of original boat left.
Will post some more pictures soon
matt
-
If you have them all out, I *highly* recommend adding some new glass in strategic areas - specifically the chines and keel. I found my glass was think there - and was starting to show some wear.
I added three layers of 1808 in inreasing widths on my chines... they are stiff. I did this because I saw James Cline's rebuild in person, and he showed me where his chines were flexing, and stress cracking some.
-
Good advice. Good build.
-
Took out the transom out last night, only some minor grinding left. The I'm going to have the inside sandblasted to give me a great surface to glass to. Amazing how strong that 41yr old transom was. Three sheets of marine ply glassed together, it must weigh almost 200 pounds. Anyone want it before I dump it lol
Starting to put my materials list together.
A piece of 2 inch coosa board blue water 26 will be first to make the new transom.
Below is the picture of the stripped boat or at least what is left of her.
Matt
http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz28 ... C00887.jpg (http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00887.jpg)
-
man that looks familiar. get a floor chisel and smack all that loose crap outta there, it saved me alot of grinding...
-
FYI, someone else told me about sandblasting the inside, but I am not sure (not saying this is a fact) that you can glass to a sandblasted surface. Sandblasting will clean a lot of stuff up, but personally I would still grind it for best adhesion...
-
Had the inside of the boat and the underside of the cap sandblasted today. Makes that 41yr old glass look brand new. Did get the template made for the full transom. I've been really busy running charters and have had no time to work on the boat. My first day off I'm going to buy materials and start putting her back together.
More pictures to follow soon. What a great resource this site is.
Thanks for the input everyone and I'm sure I will have lots more questions
Capt matt
-
nice build, looks all to familiar. I'm doing a 222 ccp. I ground my whole inside bottom and then sandblasted the hard to reach inside corners. Glass does not blast easy it is very hard, I tried many medias and found that the cheap play sand worked best. Took way longer to get the sand out then to blast it. Prep all your areas with acetone in a spray bottle then whip it up with a clean rag and you will be fine. Nice work.
-
Transom is in. Check it out. Triple tabbed. I raised the middle of the transom 3inches to give it that classic curve.
The company I had sandblast the boat did a awesome job, and the fresh glass makes laminating easy and forever. The inside of the boat looks like brand new glass.
Next I'm going to redo the cap, removing wood from the very front and replacing it with some kind of composite, probably a piece of the coosa I had left from my transom. This will be a wood free boat.
Feels good to be putting it back together.
Anyone have any thoughts on tying the cap into the stern cap? Don't know if I should continue the lip on the cap or shave it down and make the stern cap flat. I'm gonna make it 18 inches wide so my cabinet is big enough for hydraulic pump, oil tank, washdown pump, battery switch etc.
Capt Matt
http://s836.photobucket.com/albums/zz28 ... C00927.jpg (http://s836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/?action=view¤t=DSC00927.jpg)
http://s836.photobucket.com/albums/zz28 ... C00929.jpg (http://s836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/?action=view¤t=DSC00929.jpg)
-
The wider the better in the rear, because remember it tapers down (due to slant of transom) as you get closer to the floor / sole.
I did not continue the cap rail around, only because I dive out of the boat and wanted a flat surface to put my gear on, drag tanks over, etc.
Looking good, keep up the momentum!
-
Asking for opinions!!!
what composite material would be best to build stringers out of? I've been looking at closed cell foam maybe 2 or 3 inches wide or even 3/4 inch bluewater coosa board doubled up.
The foam looks like it would be easier to cut and shape to the hull than the coosa and is probably lighter
I'm going to run 4 stringers wide and bulkbeads to make a grid system.
Any info is much appreiciated
Capt Matt
-
i dont know that 4 stringers is the way to go, boat seems kind of narrow for that. id go with 2 as wide as your gas tank. i think mine are 28" apart on center. you can see how i did it on my rebuild. 2 sheets of 1" corecell was enough to do stringers and bulkheads and have some leftover.
-
Listen to DW, he speaks the truth.
-
Here is the stringer plan: I'm going to do 2 stringers wide made out of 1 inch wide coosa board then one stinger in the keel coming back from the bow to the fuel tank bulkhead. Have been working on the cap the last week and reglassed the whole inside of the boat with 1708. Every afternoon I want to glass it rains Flipped the cap and foamed in the voids, sanded it smooth and ran biaxle. It really stiffened it up. Used my trimmings from the 11/2 inch coosa transom under the front of the bow cap to mount my cleat and make it nice and solid to stand on. Plan on glassing the cap to the hull inside and out in the next few days. Every boat I have every owned the cap has bounced loose when only screwed together. I will put more hours on this boat once she is done in one year than she had in her first 41 years. Pic's posted soon.
Thanks for all your input everyone
Matt
-
If you go with 1" wide stringers you will not have much surface area to bond the sole to the stingers, you might follow Shine's project and add "cleats" to the tops of your stringers to add to bonding area. Simply stated, he basically glued some parts to the sides of the stringers at the top to give extra bonding area.
-
Here are some pictures
Have not got much done as I have been too busy fishing.
Did get the cap back on and starting to glass it to the hull.
Also picked up this tower as trade out for charters, lucked out as it has hyd helm, mercury controls, lights, gauges, wiring, 13 rod holders etc. Will probably have it powder coated white
Capt Matt
http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz28 ... C00946.jpg (http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00946.jpg)
http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz28 ... C00943.jpg (http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00943.jpg)
http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz28 ... C00942.jpg (http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00942.jpg)
-
youre glassing the cap to the hull inside and out? i might save yourself all the fairing on the outside and double up the inside. i think i ran one layer of 4" 1708 on the inside and its pretty solid, especially when i tied it in with the cap on the top of the transom. what are you planning for back there?
-
Yup, I'm going to glass the cap both inside and outside.
I ground the inside edge of the cap along with the outer edge of the boat then cabosiled the cap down. After taping a line I ground 3 inches down in the gel coat from the top of the hull. I'm going to use just enough strand on the outside so I have a smooth transition from the cap into the hull and then fare it in. On the inside I will cabosil to fill any voids between cap and hull and then one 6 inch 1708 tab. I,m going to make a 18 inch wide cap at the back along with a cabinet to hide all my pumps, fuel filter, oil tank etc.
I found one last piece of wood in her last night, a rotten chunk holding the lifting eye in the bow.
I'm thinking a pop up cleat with a 2ft piece of allthread connected to the lifting eye to replace the one I took out.
Matt
-
Here are some pic's of the work finished in the last few weeks.
Stringers are 2 sheets of 3/4 inch coosa laminated together 8 inch tab and 16 inch tab of 1708
bulk heads are 3/4 inch coosa
Still fitting them, have to cut drains in bulk heads and holes for rigging tubes etc then laminate and install them.
Matt
http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz28 ... C00972.jpg (http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00972.jpg)
http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz28 ... C00976.jpg (http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00976.jpg)
http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz28 ... C00975.jpg (http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00975.jpg)
-
WOW! :shock: That is looking great!
How is the coosa to work with? Is it as solid as it looks?
-
The coosa is so strong and yet very easy to work with. . I built the stringers out of 15# density. It was much more affordable than the Bluewater 26 which I used in the transom. Originally I was going to do a nidacore deck but after working with the coosa the deck will be coosa too.
Matt
-
is all that fairing compound in the first pic? or just reddish poly resin? looks like youre fairing for some under deck compartments or something. comin together!
-
Just building everything with red laminating resin
-
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00971-1.jpg)
-
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00974.jpg)
finally got the hang of posting a picture
Amazing what I can do when I follow directions
Matt
-
:thumright:
-
Been busy the last few weeks
Things are going slow but I can see it coming together now
Deck is all cut and ready to be fitted, fuel tank ordered and will be here next week
Matt
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00986-1.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00987-1.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00988-1.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00989-1.jpg)
-
Oh yeah, got the short stringers in too to support the tank (52 gal) they still need to be tabbed in and finally got the bulkheads laminated and all double tabbed in with 1708.
Made drains for my custom hatch channels, the two back hatches will drain out the transom,The deck hatches are all 15X18 openings, Spent two days making the hatch channels from a mold I made then sticking them under the decks plus 3 hatches in the cabinet door , rigging tubes still need to be stuck with 5200 into bulk heads
Should really see her coming together by the end of next week
Matt
-
looks like youre givin her hell! motivating me to get goin haha...
-
Picked up my fuel tank today, Sanded the bottom, cleaned it and stuck hard rubber strips on the bottom of the new tank to line up with my coffin stringers. Used plenty of 5200 so water cannot get between the tank and the rubber. Fuel tank and part of the floor should be in by the end of tomorrow. More pictures of the progress soon
Matt
-
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00994.jpg)
Still having a hard time with the photbucket, just a slow learner
-
floor glassed in, casting platform built, gussets in, rear cap glassed in
getting there now!
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00999.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00998.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00997.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC00996.jpg)
-
Looking good!!! Did you move the console forward?
:thumleft: :thumleft: :thumleft:
-
Rick
After doing lots of research and measuring of other 22 flatbacks in pictures I plan on having the front of my tower right in the middle of the boat and the console centered under it. I never did take any measurements on where the original console was mounted. The only thing that is stressing me out about the whole build is that the boat comes out balanced right and not bow heavy. Moving the fuel tank forward I hope should off set the 21inch porta bracket. I will be picking up a 45gal livewell/leaning post from hammerhead this week which will put some weight aft. Let me know your thoughts about the C.O.G. on these boats.
Matt
-
man i need to get off my ass and finish! on the cg thing, everyone ive talked to about these boats says try to put the weight more forward than back...
-
finally had some time to work on the boat, thats a full week of progress you see. She is getting closer
Matt
-
I think you'll be fine with what you're doing, it's almost identical to mine and the balance is great. If nothing else, I would have gone with slightly more weight forward because I never run with a full tank... but she is perfectly balanced when it is full.
-
Thanks LilRichard, feeling better about the balance thing now
Matt
-
Thanks for the info guys, been scratching my head about the weight thing too.
-
After not working on the boat for two weeks finally had some time
Console made (Coosa) yup thats a huge console but it fits under the tower and will have a ton of dry storage inside. Gotta shop for some hatches for the console before glassing it. Note the under cut room for my toes, I never had a boat that I could stand close enough to the console without my toes hitting it.
Hatches rough cut and started fitting them, They still need to be glassed
Gussets all glassed in and gunnels tabbed to the underside of the cap
Picked up my Livewell from Hammerhead today, It sure is pretty. (Can wait to get if filled with bait)
Capt Matt
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01011.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01010.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01009.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01008.jpg)
-
Good progress :thumright:
-
Matt, she's coming together! The hull/gunnel bond is more nice work.
Glad you have the livewell in hand, and its sweet. Good deal. Thanks for keeping us posted.
-
Killer job Capt Matt. And i'm lovin that center console. I actually enlarged mine today to add a seat in front of the center console and to be able to fit the 6 batteries. What sort of plumbing in and out are you running and what type of baitwell pump are you running? Im about to post some pics, check mine out here in a bit. Again, killer looking rebuild!
Oh and what type of tower are you doing?
-
I got a used half tower as trade out for charters from a client. It came off a 21coastal bay and was made by Action welding in the Cape. I will take it and have it powder coated at some point. Where my feet are about 51/2ft above the deck,
For livewell pumps I'm going to run two 1200gph Sunami pumps threw two seperate thru hulls, strainers etc that way when I load up on threadfins for tarpon fishing I can throw a ton of water on them until all the loose scales blow out of the drains. This two system set up also makes it easy when a pump goes out, simply hit the other switch.95% of all the fishing I do is livebait so a good system is key.
Back to fitting hatches tomorrow, my charter cancelled.
Capt Matt
-
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01015.jpg)
-
A few pictures of her flipped and sandblasted
Gonna do a little filling, extend the keel then high build epoxy primer and grey awlgrip before rolling her back over
Capt Matt
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01016.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01017.jpg)
-
extended the keel extended made with coosa and glassed on
Awl Fair skimming and lots and lots of sanding
Getting closer to putting her in primer
Just been too busy chasing tarpon to get much done
Capt Matt
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01030.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01039.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01038.jpg)
-
Looks good - this is the stage where all your efforts will show up in the final product!
-
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01044.jpg)
high build primer
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01043.jpg)
more sanding
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01047-1.jpg)
Finally finish primer
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01045.jpg)
One more light sand with 320 and ready for whisper grey awlgrip paint
Capt Matt
-
She looks sweet!!
Are you going to shoot Awlgrip or Awlcraft?
Kedd
-
thats gonna be a nice color... what about the topside?
-
awlgrip whisper grey
inside whisper grey and grey kiwi grip non skid
want to keep it nice and low key
Capt Matt
-
for sure... i think some white nonskid would look sweet with that. kind of a reverse ofwhat you normally see, and would break it up nice too. just my thought...
-
Don't touch she is still wet
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01053.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01052.jpg)
only one love bug stuck to her
72 hrs and flip her back over
Capt matt
-
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01083.jpg)
console in and in primer
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01084.jpg)
tabbed in and filled, no screw and part of the boat
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01082.jpg)
deck covered with final layer of mat and sanded
-
Finally feel like I'm getting close
been working on the cap today and trying to get everything ready for paint and kiwi grip.
This is the never ending project, gotta have it done in the next month.
Capt Matt
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01080.jpg)
lots of skimming done, just finish work now
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01079.jpg)
getting ready to mount hammerhead livewell, cabinet skimmed
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01078.jpg)
between sanding a 38 inch snook caught by one of my clients this week
19 pounds
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01081.jpg)
upper station in primer sanded and ready for paint
-
like the grey!
:salut:
-
man that cap glassed to the outside of the hull looks clean!
-
I pulled the trigger and ordered my brand new motor today
a Pro XS 175
Was looking for something light and powerful, She weighs in at 431 pounds its a 2.5L block and is right around 205hp at the prop, newest in optimax technology.
Was just gonna get a regular 200hp opti but they are roughly 500 pounds plus
Back to sanding, fitting my custom gunnel panels
Capt Matt
-
Just a few pictures of the slow progress before paint
Capt Matt
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01092.jpg)
Gunnel panels all fitted
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01091.jpg)
forward bulkhead panel fitted
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01090.jpg)
final fairing of my hatches and drain channels
-
Looks good - those are some deep drain channels - are they going to drain somewhere?
-
There is light at the end of the tunnel. You are now at the finish stage. Look to the other great recent completions here for inspiration :thumright:
Like the short casting deck, with flush-deck storage behind.
Good work.
-
you just lay up some smooth panels to set in the gunnels?
-
Thanks for the pep talk, I need it. Days of work without seeing anything, then in less than a hour she will be in primer.
I've been using cheap can's of spray on primer just to find the holes to fill, fare etc. Seems to help.
Drain channels drain right out of the boat, the front two are connected and will go out the starboard side by the original drain and the back two hatches will drain straight out the transom. Hoping for a very dry bilge.
Fiberglass 4X8 panels where made on a smooth surface with spray on pam then cut to fit the spaces between gussets then used thin cabasol to stick them. Looking for that smooth factory looking finish. I just could not seem to get it that flat by skimming and sanding. Seemed like a faster way to go too.
Capt Matt
-
Pep talks are great. Support is better 8)
Re the glass inserts. Great this topic has been brought up. We were struggling up here as to how to best finish the interior.
You're right. Spend an inordinate amount of time sanding, fairing, sanding, fairing....and then when you finally spray...well, guess it looks okay. Translation: nobody's happy...a weak point.
Your idea is exactly what we're going with. Thin glass panels to mimic the former "liner". If you could call it that. Basically was two thin glass panels from the casting deck aft. Not tied/adhered at all to the outer hull; floating from the floor to the gunnel screws. Just the way the builders did it then.
We figured the new panels would serve three purposes. First, a great looking finish, back to original appearance or better. Second, sound-deadening when running. Third, additional stiffening, especially given the non-factory adherence.
Good work.
-
A few last pictures before final paint. Rain stopped us from spraying today. What do you think of my Pine Island paint both lol
Did get it sprayed in primer weds then the final sanding, spot putty, more sanding the last 2 days
With my extra time today I glassed pads of coosa in cabinet to hold water separator, hydro pump for power pole and porta lift. Should be able to roll deck with Kiwi grip by Sunday. Any one have any tips on application of Kiwi grip, I have 2 gallons of grey but was hoping to have enough to paint inside console and cabinet.
Capt Matt
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01094.jpg)
Masked out and ready to go
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01095.jpg)
Mounts for cooler tie downs (105qt Yeti)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01096.jpg)
Gunnel panels faired in and glazing putty sanded
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01098.jpg)
Deck hatches and cabinet ready for paint
-
lookin' good Matt :thumright:
-
Gonna be a great boat! This is the fun part...
-
Paint is done, Kiwi gripped the deck/ top of cap and put the rub rail on yesturday. Today I started putting in rod holders, pop up cleats etc. The end is near now, should be dropping her off to be wired by the end of the week. Tower went in for powder coating this morning and I should have it back by Friday.
Anyone else think she looks like a FWC boat all grey like she is? just needs a black stripe and people will get out of the way.
Capt Matt
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01104.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01103.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01102.jpg)
-
She does :lol:
Looking good Matt. Lots of holes there - what's going in the console?
-
Looks Great! :thumleft:
The FWC look will cetainly keep boats away. :thumright:
-
Man, I love that transom cap curve. I disagree with the FWC remark, that boat is way too sweet looking to be mistaken for a government ride!
Well...... maybe from a distance! :shock:
I wonder if there is some kind of a removable black stripe? You could really mess with people especially if you're in a tournament and come flying up on a spot somebody's already on. Hell, they'd all freak and haul butt outta there. :lol: :lol: :lol:
If you had the stripe I wonder if you could get away with running the no wake zones like they do.
I guess it would work once , I don't know about the second time though!! :roll: :roll:
-
She does :lol:
Looking good Matt. Lots of holes there - what's going in the console?
Electronics and access hatch. Looks awesome! The ribs in the inwales...she's going to be stout.
Wished you'd have contacted me on the wiring/rigging... :D
-
Man, I love that transom cap curve. I disagree with the FWC remark, that boat is way too sweet looking to be mistaken for a government ride!
Well...... maybe from a distance! :shock:
I wonder if there is some kind of a removable black stripe? You could really mess with people especially if you're in a tournament and come flying up on a spot somebody's already on. Hell, they'd all freak and haul butt outta there. :lol: :lol: :lol:
If you had the stripe I wonder if you could get away with running the no wake zones like they do.
I guess it would work once , I don't know about the second time though!! :roll: :roll:
Lewis, ever hear of impersonating a LEO? :shock: :shock:
-
I know a guide out of Captiva that had the black stripe on his grey 24ft Morgan, it had the American Legion Logo in it. After all the questions he got at the dock about what kind of law enforcement he was with he took it off.
The console holes you see in the back are 2 storage hatches, flush mount GPS and custom switch panel I had made. The front has two big holes too, one to get to the batteries and one is a inspection/access to the wiring, switches etc. After having a flatsboat for so long and trying to crawl into small spaces to do anything, never again!
Seabob your work is the best looking I have ever seen. I have a buddy that owns the Monroe Canal Marina in St James that is trading me the labor to wire/rig for a trailer I got for the boat that is just not quite wide enough. He used to do all the east coast of Florida Henckley service and is thrilled about wiring it. This way I get to do it with him and know how everything is set up so its easy to fix down the road.
Starting to feel really proud of what I have, I will be all smiles when she goes in the water for the first time.
Capt Matt
-
You definetily will be all smiles on the maiden voyage. The boat looks great and I love the console, access is key when you have to trouble shoot something. Look forward to more photos and hearing about the maiden voyage. :salut:
-
Moving right along with the rigging, tower and livewell went into today. Console rigged with helm, controls, hatches etc. Getting so close I can taste it.
Capt Matt
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01107.jpg)
-
Smokin' :thumright:
Damn, do we do good work around the frat house or what? :lol:
And I'm with Lew...the curved transom cap is beautiful.
Can't wait for the maiden voyage. You've done a terrific job!
-
Porta lift on and motor hung, start wiring today.
Capt Matt
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01111.jpg)
-
Need bigger pics!!!
-
Still can't get that photobucket sizing of the pictures right
Matt
-
If you're taking them with a phone you may have a problem making them bigger - we support up to 800x600.
-
Took a few pictures of the progress this morning before dropping her off at York Rd Marina for them to wire the motor. Hoping to have her back by the weekend to wrap up the last few things, hatch latches and hinges, plumb my hatch drain channels and some paint touch up.
Hoping to be in the water the first part of next week, first scheduled charter is on weds so I need a day or so for the shakedown
Capt Matt
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01118.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01117.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01116.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01115.jpg)
-
Looks great!
-
She looks amazing!!!
Sooooo close :D
Kedd
-
Shipshape indeed. :thumleft:
-
:thumright: :thumright:
-
Really clean electric, awesome job.
-
Great job on the wiring,SB4 would be proud :thumright:
-
Thank you everyone for the good words, 14 months of hard work finally coming together.
I'm amazed at how much wiring was involved, there is another block below the one you see in the pictures that is just about full too. Once the engine wiring harness is in then everything can get tied up for good.
Last night I went out in the dark and was playing with the LED spotlight, running lights and spreader light They are so bright, never had LED on a boat before and was blown away and they draw such little amp's. I do a lot of running in the dark and the lights are going to make it a whole lot easier.
Should have pictures of the her first floating early next week.
Capt Matt
-
CM -
I think you should leave the tag hanging on the Opti, and name the boat "Minnie Pearl". (a few of you older guys might 'get' that joke...)
Seriously...it's a great looking rig. Very professional, which gives customers 'instant comfort' when they first see a guide boat at the ramp.
-
SWEET - your sweat equity is shining through now. :salut:
-
A few more pictures,
My dad came over today to help me finish the along with installing latches and hinges on my hatches.
We where hoping to do some final paint touch up but ran out of time. Probably a good thing anyway as I need to wait till everything is done and touch up one time only.
The Cabinet came out awesome, just need to hook up the washdown. The compression latches close nice and tight with no rattles at all.
Excuse the dirty deck, will clean it when I get it back from the final rigging stuff at the marina tomorrow. Should be floating tomorrow afternoon
Capt Matt
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01123.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01122.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01121.jpg)
-
beautiful job matt!! may she serve you well! :salut:
-
Well she finally hit the water today, I was hoping to have her in the water yesterday so I had some time for the shakedown/break in. Things took longer than expected as usual and I did not get the boat back till 5pm today. I knew there would be a few things to fix as is the case with any boats first splash.
After launching the boat I filled up with 50 gals of fuel and filled the livewell with both pumps running looking for leeks. The livewell runs like a jaquzi I can't wait to fill it full of bait. One of the drain hoses leeks a little which I figured was a possibility and did not screw the livewell to the mount for that reason, also the trim switch on upper station was reversed (both easy fixes)
So once I primed the motor with fuel I headed out the canal, picking up my buddy who did all the wiring a little way down the canal. As we reached the end of the canal the boat starved of fuel and died, the primer ball would not pump up so we managed to unhook the fuel line from the racor and pump enough fuel to get us back to the dock.
All the way back down the canal I was freaking thinking I could have kinked the fuel line somewhere inside the hull during the build. Luckily it was a easy fix as the anti syphon fitting on top of tank must have seized up. Blowing back through the fuel line showed us that the fuel line was not kinked. We switched out the aluminum fitting for a brass one with no anti syphon BB in it and primed the motor, That was the problem, another easy fix. It has been more than 6 months since I put the fuel tank in and the salt air must have done a number on the anti syphon fitting.
Getting to the end of the canal I gently pushed the throttle as the boat jumped up on plane in its own length. I started off with a very worn 21p 4 blade prop I had from my flatsboat. The boat ran 43mph on the GPS with a full tank of fuel and a full 43 gal livewell. The prop is a little large as I figured it would be, but at least it gave me a starting point. The motor would only turn up to 5300rpm. A 19p Revelution 4 prop will be order tomorrow. I think with half a tank of fuel and the right prop she will run right close to 50mph. Only time will tell but even mid to high 40's is more than I had hoped for.
For about a hour I ran the boat all over the backcountry in way less than a foot of water and the prop never even touched bottom. I ran places my shallow running 17ft flatsboat would have bumped bottom on the same low tide and never even touched. With the porta lift up she runs scary shallow just about in dirt. You do have to watch the water pressure gauge as you can lift the motor so high. Making some hard turns she never slid out and handled like a dream
The snap your head back mid range torque with the pro XS 175 is incredible and will only be better with the 19p prop. At one point I shut her down in about a foot of water, raised the porta lift up past vertical, dropped the trim tabs and hopped her right up on plane. Its amazing how shallow this boat will get up on top. 3800rpm is about 30mph burning roughly 6gph. I think the boat will do better when I get the hang of running it and everything dialed in. At slow speed with the braket up this boat will idle in just 8 inches of water.
I'm taking my first charter on the boat tomorrow AM and should have most of the small little stuff to fix done in the next day or so. I knew a flatback could do awesome things if built light and rigged right but even in the first hour of running the boat surpassed all my expectations.
Thank you everyone for your help on the build and I will post some pictures of her in action.
Capt Matt
-
Excellent report and story...damn anti-siphon valve, again.
I'd love to be on that charter tomorrow morning...what a sweet ride.
Matt, best wishes from all of us to you on the first charter of your new ride, first thing in the morning ....BURN 'EM UP friend :lol:
-
Sweet boat! Where did you get those hatches?
-
Thanks luv2fish
I ended up making every hatch on the boat. Just don't seem to be able to find a good quality plastic hatch that lasts more than about a year in the Florida sun without cracking. I built the deck hatches all sized for a bucket or a milk crate to fit in. I spent many many hours during the rebuild making and fitting cabinet hatches and deck hatches with drain channels.
First charter on her went ok, my clients loved the boat and caught a few keeper reds and stayed comfortable and dry on a very windy swfl morning.
Capt Matt
-
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01125-1.jpg)
-
I was always under the assumption that dogs liked chasing catfish not reds. :roll:
Did they tip? 8)
PS.....Looks sweet in that shot. :thumright:
-
Nice! Do you have a closeup of the hatches and drain channels?
What did you use for the core and glass layup?
-
I made all the hatches with coosa board. The deck hatches are 3/4 inch like the deck and the cabinet and cabinet hatches are 1/2 inch coosa. I used the 1/2 inch coosa on the cabinet so I could bend it enough to make the transom cap. I'm sure you could do the same thing with wood too, it would just be a heavier.
To make the floor hatch drain channels I made a jig out of PVC pipe, sprayed it with pam and laid biaxle over it to make a semi circle. After letting the glass go off I did some fine tuning. I then re wrapped and triple tabbed them with biaxle into the underneath of the deck before the deck went down. When making the hatch lids I used the pieces I cut out of the floor. After rounding and sanding the edges of the hatch lids I wrapped the lids with mat and re fitted, laying more mat in spots and sanding in others until the small gap was close to uniform in size. Then I gradually sanded the top edge of the drain channel until the hatches sat flush.
The drains I made out of 90 degree pvc pipe. I cut holes in the corners of the drain channels, scuffed up the pvc and glassed them in. Both front floor hatches hook together and drain out of the boat, both rear floor hatches are plumed together and drain out the transom.
Making the hatches involved a 10X more work than I thought it would. Gause sells pre made fiberglass floor hatches but at $800 a pop I could not bring myself to buy them and they wher not the exact side I wanted.
The cabinet hatches did not require a drain channel so they went much quicker
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01090.jpg)
(http://i836.photobucket.com/albums/zz281/captmattmitchell/DSC01092.jpg)
-
very good work. how did the pam work as a releasing agent? I would think the PVC wouldnt allow the resin to stick by its self.
I remember reading a while back about the davidgause.com website (i think thats what it was) where you could buy consoles and hatches but I cant find that website anymore... $800!? somebody's proud.
-
The pam worked really well as a release agent. I also used it when making sheets of glass to cover my inner gunnels.
The Gause hatches are nice hatches also add to the cost the price hinges and a ss latch.
Capt Matt
-
Really a beautiful job Captain! One question, why did you decide to use a dual lever throttle/shift control? I would have thought a single lever would make for easier handling?
You seem to have hit the jackpot with your power/weight/balance choices. I'm working on a '76 22-2 and leaning towards a Suzuki DF175 on a porta bracket. I hope it turns out to be as good of a fit.
Thanks for taking the trouble to post your work. It is invaluable as a guide for those who come after!
Charlie
-
Charlie
I looked at a lot of different dual control set ups and the Morse are by far the simplest set up and just about bullet proof. They are good quality chrome with no plastic on them to crack in the sun and they last and last. They have two adjustable nuts on each one to adjust the trntion on the shift/throttle. I have seen 20 plus year old ones still in action. On my flats boat I had to replace the Mercury binacle control every 3 yrs or so, it would simply wear out and have salt damage.
Besides that the Morse controls are way way cheaper than OEM dual station controls or fly by wire controls. If I remember right the Morse controls where about $400 each plus I bought the top of the line shift and throttle cables. Some dual station controls where as much as $6K, seems the sky is the limit on dual station controls. I had ran a few boats in the past with Morse controls and really liked big boat two lever shift throttle thing. Once you get the hang of it its really easy to use and seems to be less work to move the boat around in close quaters by simply bumping the shift knob in and out of F-N-R.
The Morse and Smartcraft fly by wire controls I have ran on other boats just seemed too smooth/soft and too easy to bump to wide open when riding through sea's with your hand on the throttle.
I also had my controls rigged with no neutral saftey switches but they saftey switches are available. I use the telaflex turn signal witches for the trim and porta lift, they are awesome as you never have to take your hands off the wheel. I recently got two chrome/red throttle knobs for the controls but cannot seem to find the black chrome shift knobs. They look way cooler than the stock plastic red and black stock balls on the end of the controls.
The porta lift is a must have, you will love it. For shallow water operation its simply tits. I had no idea how much faster and better it is than a standard jackplate.
I still have some small finishing touches on the boat as she is still a work in progress. Today I got my Edson finishing nuts for both Uflex helms which look awesome. Even at $45 a nut I feel these little small detail touches really add more character to the boat. Tomorrow the last of my LED lights should be hooked up and the last of the wiring tied up. Then when I get a chance I have a little paint to touch up where it got chipped during the rigging. No client or anyone else would ever notice these little things but I do. I'm just happy she is in the water catching fish and making some of my investment back.
Capt matt
-
Good stuff!
Morse controls. The standard. Old-style Palm Beach, the good stuff. To an aficionado client...shows that you know your business.
Good deal Matt.
-
Really a beautiful job Captain! One question, why did you decide to use a dual lever throttle/shift control? I would have thought a single lever would make for easier handling?
You seem to have hit the jackpot with your power/weight/balance choices. I'm working on a '76 22-2 and leaning towards a Suzuki DF175 on a porta bracket. I hope it turns out to be as good of a fit.
Thanks for taking the trouble to post your work. It is invaluable as a guide for those who come after!
Charlie
I agree with Matt on the Morse controls. Very easy to get used to and less expensive that OEM.
I have the DF175 on the back of my 24 proline flatback and love it. Plenty of power and very quiet. Easy to maintain.
The Porta Bracket is the way to go. I have one on mine and I opted to get the built on swim platforms with it. I considered standard fiberglass platform but I liked the built in feature and the look much better.
-
Thanks for the feedback guys. I am sold on the Porta Bracket, and I'll probably buy the model with the built in platform (seems like a time/labor saver if nothing else). I was toying with the idea of fly by wire controls because of all of the turns the control cables will have to make. Can the Morse control cables handle a sharp bend? I'll be running my cables from the console under the deck (90 degree turn) to the stern, where they will have to turn up (90 degrees), then another (90 degree) turn to go out through the transom to the motor. Though maybe there is a way to run the cables without all the turns... ?
-
I ran two big rigging tubes and used sewer sweeps instead of 90 degree ends but I don't think there will be any problem if you use by high end telaflex cables. The upper station cables simply go into the lower control box then just one set goes back to the motor. Mine are way smooth, a lot smoother than I thought they would be. I don't think your system would have any more bends than mine does. I know they probably have all the kinks worked out of the fly by wire controls but I think I trust old school cables more.
Capt Matt
-
Ditto on simple, reliable old technology! I have the Glendenning fly by wire controls on my Tiara. They are fabulous when they work, which is almost all of the time, but when they get glitch it is a major pain to track it down.
Thanks for all of the advice!
Charlie
-
WOW-Just followed this all the way thru impressive!!!
Gimme some pointers on plumbing the live well behind the CC.
Would like to do something like that on my 17
Pump for fresh/clean water? I plan on keeping mine in the water so Iam a "leary" on a thru-Hull pump as to growth etc.
what about Rec & drain?
Thanks
-
I bought the hammerhead live well which is probably a little too big/heavy for a 17ft boat. It holds 43 gallons of water which is a lot of weight (300# estimate). I Would suggest something in the 15-20 gallon range for your 17 footer. The hammerhead well is mounted on top of a 2 inch high collar thats made out of fiberglass as you can see in the pictures. The center of the collar is cut out in the floor to run the plumbing then the feed lines and drain holes are cut through the bulkheads, then there is a 11/2 inch hole in the transom for the drain.
Don't worry about having a thru hull fitting on a boat that will sit in the water I have never had a problem with growth inside and if you want to keep anything but shrimp alive in the Florida summers its the only way to go.
Capt Matt
-
I bought the hammerhead live well which is probably a little too big/heavy for a 17ft boat. It holds 43 gallons of water which is a lot of weight (300# estimate). I Would suggest something in the 15-20 gallon range for your 17 footer. The hammerhead well is mounted on top of a 2 inch high collar thats made out of fiberglass as you can see in the pictures. The center of the collar is cut out in the floor to run the plumbing then the feed lines and drain holes are cut through the bulkheads, then there is a 11/2 inch hole in the transom for the drain.
Don't worry about having a thru hull fitting on a boat that will sit in the water I have never had a problem with growth inside and if you want to keep anything but shrimp alive in the Florida summers its the only way to go.
Capt Matt
Thanks for the respond-
So the top of the tank "over-flow" is plumbed straight to the transom, Iam "assuming" above the water line if so. how far up or is it just below the bottom level of the tank?
Thanks
-
The main overflow drain and the end of the day drain (to empty well) are plummed together under the well with a Y pipe. This way you only need one thru hull drain for both, I did my 11/2inch drain right at the waterline so the outpouring water is not loud and does not spook fish in shallow water I can also use a 12 inch drain pipe in the well if I don't want to carry a full 43 gal of water around. Main thing is all the water drains from the tank when not in use. As long as the drain is a straight run below the deck level you will have no problems. Double hose clamp everything too.
Capt Matt
-
The main overflow drain and the end of the day drain (to empty well) are plummed together under the well with a Y pipe. This way you only need one thru hull drain for both, I did my 11/2inch drain right at the waterline so the outpouring water is not loud and does not spook fish in shallow water I can also use a 12 inch drain pipe in the well if I don't want to carry a full 43 gal of water around. Main thing is all the water drains from the tank when not in use. As long as the drain is a straight run below the deck level you will have no problems. Double hose clamp everything too.
Capt Matt
I know the key word is "Straight"-Any hints on how? -Hard pipe or what type of hose-Thanks
-
I used soft 11/2inch white livewell hose for the drain and made it a straight shot out the back
Capt Matt