Classic AquaSport
Aquasport Model Rebuilds, Mods, Updates and Refreshes => Osprey Style Hull Rebuilds => 22-2 Rebuilds => Topic started by: ftac03 on September 27, 2016, 02:08:51 PM
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I'm planning to take this family fisherman down to the stringers and rebuild as a center console. If you need any of the hardware let me know. The windshield frame and glass is in good condition and for sale. I'm sure this has been done before, any links to a conversion of the family fisherman out there?
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/Mobile%20Uploads/5FC57B4B-05D5-4013-BBBB-EF44045C3BF9_zpssm1z5ajo.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/Mobile%20Uploads/5FC57B4B-05D5-4013-BBBB-EF44045C3BF9_zpssm1z5ajo.jpg.html)
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Can't recall having seen that done before but it certainly doesn't mean it has not nor cannot.
Good luck and post pics of your progress. :thumright:
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Seems to me, when the liner comes out it is essentially the same thing as a 222 ccp.
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there have been a few threads where people have started this, but never completed the threads.
one of the bigger tasks to think about is where your cap will be. are you going to make a flat cap at the rub rail, like an osprey, or keep the "raised" cap like a ccp.
once you have it gutted, you will also need to beef up the gunwales I would think. exterior wise, and for the most part- stringer-wise, they are the same hull.
cant tell from the pic- is that an Outboard, or I/O that has been pulled?
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It's an outboard. I think I'll do a flat gunwale at the rubrail so I can run a trolling motor on the bow. No liner with a workboat finish. I don't want to reinvent the wheel on this project.
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sounds good. there are a few boats on here that have been converted to mulletboats- you could follow their lead and have great results. caps are "simple" to build. you could start once you pull everything and make "knees" for the cap to rest on. then form your cap from those.
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Thanks chris. Any threads in particular? I've looked at a bunch of threads but haven't seen any about mulletboats. Probably because I've been looking at the ccp threads mostly.
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Here is the mullet boat thread http://classicaquasport.com/smf/index.php?topic=11965.0
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That's the one I was thinking of, Rick beat me to it.
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Thank yall for the info. I'll be pretty busy running trips with fall redfish season fixing to start in Lousiana. So, progress will probably be pretty slow until the January. The hull looks to have been stored inside or under cover. I'm hoping when I get the liner out of it ta find stringers in decent shape. Either way I'll replace the foam that needs replacement and have about decided to go ahead and fill the transom. I've been kind of back and forth about wood or composite for the deck and transom. I'm thinking wood would have reasonable longevity and lower costs than composite.
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I started the teardown yesterday and it was suprising. The cushions in the cuddy were in good shape for being a 78' vintage
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/Mobile%20Uploads/20161009_122534_zpsahemnqtg.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20161009_122534_zpsahemnqtg.jpg.html)
Pretty cool find. You don't see these anymore.
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/Mobile%20Uploads/20161009_123032_zpsyspwqf1j.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20161009_123032_zpsyspwqf1j.jpg.html)
The destruction began. I used the skill saw for the most part and man does it chuck some dust. I've got the itch. LOL
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/Mobile%20Uploads/20161009_151636_zpsnonbjcqc.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20161009_151636_zpsnonbjcqc.jpg.html)
Obviously someone has done a gas tank job on this boat. The original tank sat on top of the liner which I thought was interesting.
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/Mobile%20Uploads/20161009_155709_zpsfcmjrarb.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20161009_155709_zpsfcmjrarb.jpg.html)
I was a little concerned when I cut the cap away on the port side. The gunwales bowed out a couple of inches. Should I try to pull them back in and measure? It doesn't seem like the bow is enough to worry about and should not impact the running surface. Any thoughts on this? My intent was to leave 4-6" of the cap for structural support during disassembly. But that it doesn't seem to support much.
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/Mobile%20Uploads/20161009_175210_zpsmuybij4f.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20161009_175210_zpsmuybij4f.jpg.html)
These make disassembly so much more enjoyable. I prob had a couple too many through the course of the day yesterday.
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/Mobile%20Uploads/20161009_175257_zpsvlpqnosz.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20161009_175257_zpsvlpqnosz.jpg.html)
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It's probably a good idea to preserve the original hull shape, so I'd make some kind of jig to hold things in place.
If you can, try to preserve some of the angles when you cut the cap. For example, if you kept 6-8" where the cap rounded over to the cabin top,I doubt the gunwale would have bowed so much.
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Love the orange plaid cushions! We had a LazyBoy chair that was about the same colors back in the 70s.
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I started a thread in the Family Fisherman section but since this boat is going back together as a center consolve I thought it might be a better fit on this forum. I finally managed to get her torn down to the stringers.(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/IMG_1704_zpssuh7gbmk.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/IMG_1704_zpssuh7gbmk.jpg.html)
The good new is this boat must have lived inside the majority of the time. The foam in the stringers is dry and the transom is solid for the most part. I drilled some holes around the drain plug and of course it's wet and soft but I wouldn't say rotten.(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/IMG_1705_zpsziosj9h8.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/IMG_1705_zpsziosj9h8.jpg.html) The starboard stringer has a bad spot where the helm was located. I would have thought the helm chair screws probably allowed moisture intrusion but this is farther forward.(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/IMG_1707_zps63f01nni.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/IMG_1707_zps63f01nni.jpg.html)
There is a thin sheet of plywood inside the stringer which is almost completely rotted. The glass is very thin where the plywood was located. I can't tell how bad of shape the glass is in this spot. I would appreciate some input on feasability of repair. I think it would be easier to fix than fabricate a new set of stringers.
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They glued plywood in there to screw straps into to hold the fuel tank down. Clean it up and get a good look at the stringer glass. Hopefully not too much delam!
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Dirtwheels thanks for the reply. The glass gets kind of thin where the plywood was glassed in. I'll be starting on the transom first, but my thought about the stringer repair is this.
1. Cut the top out of the problem area.
2. Dig out the old foam and pour new foam
3. Cut out the old thin and delaminated glass in the problem area and tab in new glass. 2 layers of 17oz biax maybe?
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sounds like a good plan on your stringers. 1708 is strong enough, make sure to stagger your layers.
before you get too far on your stringers, 99% of rebuilds raise the floors atleast 1.5-2" higher than original.
lots of different methods for this- use your existing stringers- add ledger boards to the sides and fill with foam- then remove the ledger boards and glass over the whole stringer. Or, build up the stringers by adding layers of Coussa board or a similar "non-wood" material and then glassing over everything.
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I got a good bit of progress made this weekend. Of course I spent more time hunting than working on the boat but some days you've just got to go.
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/IMG_1741_zpsroq8zzrk.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/IMG_1741_zpsroq8zzrk.jpg.html)
So when I finally got the Aquasport pretty good progress was made. I cut the middle stringer out. As you would expect it was rotten as all get out, and fairly easy to remove.
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/IMG_1746_zps9qsw4jgb.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/IMG_1746_zps9qsw4jgb.jpg.html)
I'll let it dry a day or two and grind the rest of it out. I also remove the glass around what was left of the backing for the bow eye. The core was almost completely gone.
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/IMG_1745_zpssvtghuat.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/IMG_1745_zpssvtghuat.jpg.html)
Also removed the through hulls for the scupper drains, and the bilge exit.
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/IMG_1744_zpspxamwjlo.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/IMG_1744_zpspxamwjlo.jpg.html)
Finally, I marked the stringers where I intend to cut for the transom replacement. It's about 19" forward of the transom. Do yall have any thoughts on this. I could certainly go less if needed?
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/IMG_1743_zpse0y0mfam.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/IMG_1743_zpse0y0mfam.jpg.html)
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/IMG_1742_zpsnnsocmts.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/IMG_1742_zpsnnsocmts.jpg.html)
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Looks like you have some good groceries for a little while now :103: :thumleft:
Good progress on the boat - your plan looks good, you will or should do 3 lams of 1708 after you get the transom core in, 4", 8", 12", so 18-19" is ok. :thumleft:
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What would you guys reccomend for a lamination schedule on the transom. I'll be using2 layers of 3/4" marine grade plywood & epoxy. It's my understanding that the layup with be less with plywood than with coosa.
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I did a layer of wood, 3/4oz CSM, 1708, 3/4oz CSM, wood and then resin coated the result. I used poly for the lam of the wood. After beefing up the transom with several lams of 1708, I mixed thickened epoxy and troweled that onto the inside of the transom and stuck the core into place and clamped. Finally I did 3 layers of 1708 with 4" overlap onto the side and floor to lam the core into the hull.I would recommend putting a piece of PVC into the drain hole and glue it down before you start beefing up the transom otherwise the low point in the boat will not be at the transom anymore but will be about a foot in front of the transom.
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Transom is out.
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/D28F7E5E-E6CA-4C02-B43D-992C7C6D5D7D_zpslafzh3uc.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/D28F7E5E-E6CA-4C02-B43D-992C7C6D5D7D_zpslafzh3uc.jpg.html)
Seems To have some delamination around the drain plug. Should I just grind out that layer?
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/5B48CA38-7577-44B4-9620-071D492F915B_zpsn7vlevnl.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/5B48CA38-7577-44B4-9620-071D492F915B_zpsn7vlevnl.jpg.html)
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/9361D100-5B21-4771-96DE-D43E80043AB0_zpswacmzpko.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/9361D100-5B21-4771-96DE-D43E80043AB0_zpswacmzpko.jpg.html)
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It's important to bond the new transom into clean glass. If I'm reading your pictures correctly, it looks like you have the outer transom skin, then some bonding putty, then the liner. If that's the case, I would grind away the liner and putty into the outer transom skin. I hope that 2x4 brace is well attached. It's the only thing keeping the shape of your hull.
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Ditto what ^^ said. You need to grind that last layer of wood out until you get to bare glass and of course grind all the surrounding areas smooth.
Good progress though :thumleft:
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Was that a plastic elbow on the gas tank? :c029:
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I got a little too aggressive with the hammer and crow bar getting the last layer of the transom wood out. Manged to crack the outer skin in the circle area. What would be the best approach here? I am thinking I'll cut the damanged area out, approx 6" of the lip. Grind back the lip to a nice bevel at 12:1, clamp a melamine dam up to the lip and lay in thickened putty and build up with 1708 until I get back to the original thickness. Once the repair cures, I will fair it out reasonably well and proceed with the transom replacement. Have I missed any steps here?(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/as%20transom_zpsbh2wknwl.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/as%20transom_zpsbh2wknwl.jpg.html)
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I can't see what you've got going on in the picture. Do you still have the wood between the skins? All of the wood, inner skin and liner need to be removed. Then, you feather the outer skin from the transom corner to 0". Attach your waxed Melamine form and glass to build up the outer skin. Then laminate in your core.
If I'm miss reading your photo, and you've already removed the wood and inner glass, then I wouldn't make the repair as a separate step. I would tab in a little extra glass to repair the spot and build up the outer skin in one step. The more you can do wet on wet, the better. It's stronger and you have less sanding.
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I can't see what you've got going on in the picture. Do you still have the wood between the skins? All of the wood, inner skin and liner need to be removed. Then, you feather the outer skin from the transom corner to 0". Attach your waxed Melamine form and glass to build up the outer skin. Then laminate in your core.
If I'm miss reading your photo, and you've already removed the wood and inner glass, then I wouldn't make the repair as a separate step. I would tab in a little extra glass to repair the spot and build up the outer skin in one step. The more you can do wet on wet, the better. It's stronger and you have less sanding.
I think you read my post correctly. I'll need to remove about 6" of the lip which is circled in the pic above. So I should make the repair part of the transom replacement and do it in one step.
When filling in the void left from cutting the old transom out. Should I use a layer or two of csm against the melamine, then laminate 3 layers of 1708. Or, will 3 layers of 1708 be to fill the void from the cutout and make a smooth surface to laminate the coosa against?
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If you're using poly or vinylester resin, the CSM makes a great cosmetic layer then the 1708 for structure. I'd use a layer or two of CSM then build up with 1708 to flush. Let it gel then go with full layers for transom.
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Things are going pretty well. I've got the transom ground out and ready to glass. Decided to go ahead and remove the foam from the stringers before glassing the transom. I lack about half of the port side of having all the foam removed. The stringers are in decent shape, there is no delamination. I have a couple of cracks that should repair fairly easy.
Is it not necessary to try and core the stringers after removing the rotten balsa on the inside? I was thinking you could glass in some 1/4" closed cell foam on the outside. I definitely want to beef up the stringer skins during the rebuild.
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Another option is to scruff up the outside of the stringers and lam a layer of 1708 (or 2) across the entire stringer.
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I did a layer of wood, 3/4oz CSM, 1708, 3/4oz CSM, wood and then resin coated the result. I used poly for the lam of the wood. After beefing up the transom with several lams of 1708, I mixed thickened epoxy and troweled that onto the inside of the transom and stuck the core into place and clamped. Finally I did 3 layers of 1708 with 4" overlap onto the side and floor to lam the core into the hull.I would recommend putting a piece of PVC into the drain hole and glue it down before you start beefing up the transom otherwise the low point in the boat will not be at the transom anymore but will be about a foot in front of the transom.
RickK could you elaborate more on the pvc and drain plug please? I'm a bit confused on this but that's nothing unusual.
Thanks
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Ok, here you go:
If you look at the low spot in a factory hull it is at the transom where the drain hole is (top portion of pic) - As we start to lam in new core and all the layers of the low point moves forward in the hull (lower portion of pic)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data/500/pvc_pipe_drain_drwgs1.png) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=12733&title=pvc-pipe-drain-drwgs1&cat=500)
I think my low spot is now about a foot in front of the transom - if I would have thought this through earlier I wouldn't have the drain problem (everyone has this problem if they rebuild their transoms "beefy")
So if you glue a 12" length of 1" ID PVC to the hull with it aligned with the hole and cut the core around it and as you lay you lams, include laying it over the PVC, you can eventually grind back the PVC at an angle at the low spot in the hull.
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data/500/pvc_pipe_drain_drwgs2.png) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=12734&title=pvc-pipe-drain-drwgs2&cat=500)
Here is a thread where Hawgleg followed this idea - he says it works great. I always have a 1/2" of water in my bilge now :41:
http://classicaquasport.com/smf/index.php?topic=13148.msg134262#msg134262
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It's been 6 weeks since I last posted. Most of the time I've been grinding, removing foam, and the center stringer. Yesterday I got the transom dam up and I can see some progress.
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/IMG_2064_zpsds1dmbgn.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/IMG_2064_zpsds1dmbgn.jpg.html)
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/IMG_2065_zps3yatho4o.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/IMG_2065_zps3yatho4o.jpg.html)
I have gaps at the top of the transom that I'm not exactly sure what to do about?? I'm thinking that I should fill these gaps with modeling clay as a temporary form. Any input would be greatly appreciated. The rest of the transom dam has a really nice tight finish with nothing more than a 1/16" gap all the way around.
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/IMG_2067_zpsr3ebrtyp.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/IMG_2067_zpsr3ebrtyp.jpg.html)
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/IMG_2068_zpsgbgjtmh0.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/IMG_2068_zpsgbgjtmh0.jpg.html)
Finally the scupper drains and bilge drains will get recovered with glass from the new transom. Should I just laminate over these holes, or should I attempt to make a plug that goes in the hold and then laminate over that? What have you guys done in the past? Thanks for the the help. - JLW
(http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m120/ftac03/IMG_2083_zpsfgai6yay.jpg) (http://s102.photobucket.com/user/ftac03/media/IMG_2083_zpsfgai6yay.jpg.html)
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Should I be concerned with the lack of responses to the post above? Is it a total cluster f#$%k??
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So when Luke and I closed in the transom on his 246 we used a sheet of 1/8" thick msg with a light texture on it. In hindsight I would suggest a full sheet of whiteboard MDF because it has a glossy super slick finish which would yeild a nearly perfect part HOWEVER YOU MUST reinforce the back of either one where it is straight or you'll end up cracking the gelcoat and making a mess of it. If you look at my gallery you can see where and how we did his.
You won't like what happens when you put modeling Clay in that gap. You'll grind for days and be itching for months.
Only the osprey style hulls have flat transom the rest curve forward a few inches from the hull sides. Took me and Luke some serious head scratching to figure out how to move forward and our closure came as an afterthought and after our core was back in however except for getting the sammich effect with the skin and the core I'd do it again this way.
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Levi,
That's a 3/4" sheet of Melamine I used for the dam. It wouldn't take much to add some stiffeners. Would you share or PM me how you closed in the gaps? The more I look, I'm thinking I could just leave gap open and fair the corners with thickened epoxy after the dam comes off??
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Hhhhh
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I’m resurrecting this project and was hoping to get some input on what to do about the keel stringer on this boat. Does it need replacing or can I reinforce the are with 1708?
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(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data/500/A011BB4A-907A-4E44-ACA5-4A16A6B79828.jpeg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=20222&title=a011bb4a-907a-4e44-aca5-4a16a6b79828&cat=500)
(http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/data/500/8DFC2259-EA60-4662-BFC2-1FD6564BA255.jpeg) (http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=20221&title=8dfc2259-ea60-4662-bfc2-1fd6564ba255&cat=500)
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The transom looks like it came out nice. How did the upper corners come out that you were concerned about.
As for the center stringer, I as still unsure why they put that in, my 170 didn't have one. So you have a hollow there now that I think I would mix up some thickened resin, thickened with chopped fiber and press that into the hollow and let it harden. Then you can grind it flush and cover with 1708.
Are the knees against the transom permanent or are you using them to make a template for new composite knees?
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The knees are permanent. There’s 2 layers of 1708 on each side of the brace and tabbed in with 3 layers of 12oz 12”’ 9” & 6”. The transom turned out well. The outside skin is not that great. I had to grind out some fairly large voids but the inside came out as good as I could hope for. All in all she’s solid as a rock. I like the idea of filling with putty and glassing over. I used aquatec for the transom core and decided to use bcx exterior for bulkheads and floors.