1993 Aquasport 250 Explorer - Newbie

[FisherDan]

Hello Everyone - Just discovered this board, looks like a great resource. I am a rookie boat owner, and my first boat is a 93 Aquasport 250 Explorer, so I have a lot to learn.

I have a problem that I am asking for help on. I am getting water into the cabin after rainstorms, sometimes more on the order of 1-2 gallons after a big storm. This has been happening for a while so I have some mildew and other damage to deal with. I know at least some water is coming in from around the base of the windshield where a couple of the screws were missing (now fixed) and some of the neoprene-like seal over the screws is gone (I can see water stains on the carpet directly under those screws). This will be fixed more permanently this winter by lifting the windshield and resetting the screws and seal, as well as replacing a couple hatches with missing latches and a new rub rail. I have re-sealed the windows and other joints around the cabin. But I am still getting the same amount of water in the cabin, so I don't think these are the primary sources.

Most of the water seems to be coming in through the anchor locker, because when I take the cushions out I can see water stains in the forward section of the cabin that are clearly coming from the wall to the locker, and can find a lot of moisture there after a storm. I look inside the locker box and pull all the rope out, but I do not see any sort of drain into the bilge or out of the boat from inside the locker.

So, where is water that gets into the anchor locker supposed to go, and any suggestions on how to fix this? I understand there may be a forward bilge pump and I seem to have a discharge port on the starboard side forward of the cabin, but I do not see any hatch or other access for a bilge or pump (and no drain from the anchor box, anyway). When I toggle the bilge switch (which is the double, on-off-on type) only the bilge pump in the transom works.

Thanks for any help!

FisherDan
Wall, NJ

[Capt. Bob]

Welcome aboard FD.

Click on the link and read the last post. Then move to the next page. The boat mentioned is older than yours but the pump situation may be the same.


http://classicaquasport.com/smf/index.php?topic=4404.0

RickK has the 230 model of your boat and I have the 210.
Water enters my cabin through the mounting points on the bow rail. Like any "roof leak" they can travel a fair distance from the point of penetration.

Water that enters the forward bilge is conveyed to the rear bilge via a 2" pvc pipe into the tank coffin. There it travels under a raised section of floor (that the tank sits on) to another 2" pipe that exits into the rear bilge. I'm not sure that a drain pipe exists on the forward bulkhead. I'll check mine tonight but logic would dictate that it would so as to allow water from the anchor rode an exit. <!-- s:scratch: --><!-- s:scratch: -->
 
RickK will pipe up on the forward bilge pump. On mine, I have an inspection plate on the bottom floor of the cabin that allows access to the pump. The pump transfers water through a thru-hull fitting on the starboard side.

Post some pics of the cabin area and the whole boat too.
Good luck.

Edit:

This is a pretty good representation of the way my stringer system looks. I'd bet yours is close. The forward center bulkhead is the one in question. It's hard to tell if there is a pipe drain on that section though the other two that I mentioned are seen in this pic.

[RickK]

Welcome aboard FisherDan :!:  :!:
I think you probably have the rare model of the 250 - they were only made for 2 years (93-94) - GREAT boat, lots of room, sharp prow and no strakes.  TOTALLY different from the explorers prior or after.  With twins and a bracket, it should fly too (well almost   ).
http://www.classicaquasport.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/2778/sort/1/cat/547/page/1
 My buddy Dave has one ( Dave's does 52mph with twin 200s)


and I remember him telling me he had to drill into (or more likely "out" of) the anchor locker and make a drain out the side and cover it with a rear facing stainless cap.
When I first got my 230 I noticed the anchor locker didn't drain anywhere too    - I drilled a hole in the bottom of the locker so it drained into the bilge.  Had I know what Dave did on his I probably would have went that way - out the side.
Is there no cover on the locker up top to divert the rain?  How's it getting in?  On my 230 I have a covered hawse that the rode goes in - hard for water to get into it unless it comes in with the line.  I usually leave the line on the deck, wash it off and let it dry before I stuff it back into the locker.
Show us some pix  

[FisherDan]

Hi Rick and Bob - Thanks for the response, certainly good info.

Here is a picture. The T-top was installed after-market in the late 1990's. She has fairly new (350 hours) twin Yamaha HPDI 200's and yes, she does pretty good although I can't say I have had her over 50 mph. With the waves up here, there are few occasions where I can get to 30 knots without getting beat to death. But I had her over 40 in a back bay, and she definitely has more in her.



Some modifications were made over the years, including pulling out the sink/range and the head and replacing them with tackle storage cabinets. This boat has lived a good fishing life, and that is what I will continue to do with her (my wife refuses to go on the boat since it doesn't have a potty; no way am I putting one in!).

Here is a photo of the base of the windshield, right in the middle:



You will see that some of the black neoprene stuff that fits in the groove over the screws is missing just like in this portion. In some places, screws that hold the windshield down were also missing. There is staining on the carpet inside the cabin under these screws, so I know that at least some water was getting in there. See this photo of one such water stain:



But I struggle to believe that screw holes allow in the volume of water we get. The main source of water in the cabin seems to be coming in from the forward bulkhead, as you can see from the water stains in this picture:



That rececessed area by the counter top also collects water. After a big rain on Wednesday morning, the carpet between it and the bulkhead was wet and there was new water in that recessed pit. But that is not the only place, because after a big rainstorm, I often get upwards of two gallons of water in the bottom of the cabin, well below the level of that pit.

The next photo shows the discharge port on the starboard side of the boat, near the forward part of the cabin. This is NOT the old port for the sink, which is on the port side right where the tank used to be and can be seen in the first photo (I can see this on the inside, it is capped inside the carbin and does not seem to be leaking).



This last photo is inside the anchor locker. Yes I still have the hatch and it is attached, fits well and is not warped or damaged. And the hole for the rope to come out has a raised edge so that very little water could get in there. But there was water inside the box and obvious moisture problems, and there is no drain. I assume water gets in where around the lip of the hatch; there is no gasket or anything, it sits in a groove just like the fish boxes (except it is hinged), and water gets in the fish boxes pretty easily (I usually help the fish boxes drain out after I wash the boat upon returning; water gets in around the lip on the floor). You can see that the piece of wood in the bottom of the photo of the anchor locker is pretty rotten.



So...I can not see any place that the port on the forward starboard side could be draining, and no evidence of a hatch or anything. Any ideas on the water? I will go around and seal the various bow rail screws, T-top screws, etc. The rub rail also is also loose and that will get addressed this winter. But I struggle to believe that loose or even a few missing screws can allow gallons of water in from one rain storm, and the only other thing I see is the anchor box.

Thanks again for all of your help!

FisherDan

[RickK]

Yup, the rare version of 250  
How about that vent/hatch above the cabin/bed?  The staining up front looks like it is right under the molded-in seat up front.  Thats' a lot of water to be found and I doubt all of that could get into the anchor locker and then spill out into the cabin.  I would definitely drill a drain or 2 in the locker so it drains outboard.
The drain on the starboard side looks too big to be the bilge exhaust.  I think Dave has his toilet outlet in the same area - could it be from the head you removed?. The outlet I see on the port side looks to be the size of a bilge drain.  Was that the side the sink was on?  Is that the old sink drain?

[FisherDan]

Hi Rick

I thought the hatch over the cabin was a good suspect, so I re-sealed it during the summer. I didn't see any evidence that it was leaking, no water stains or obvious wetness inside around it. The rubber seal around the window is still soft and pliable. But the caulk around the frame on the outside was dry so I scraped it out and resealed it. After sealing it there was no difference in the amount of water. So that wasn't it.

Yes the water staining is also under the molded seat, maybe a little in front of it. The screws that originally held the cushion are still there but ripped out of the flap on the cushion itself; we have the cushion and just put it out when we want to use it. I suppose I should remove those screws and seal the holes. But there are no cracks in the fiberglass, and the screws are all in their holes, so again I don't see how very much water could get in there. I will certainly go take another very close look.

The discharge on the port side is located just inside the cabin door, and on the inside it is accessible behind some drawers. It is capped on the inside, and I do not see any evidence of leakage around it. I assume that was for the sink due to location and height. But the sink and the head were removed long ago, so I don't know for sure.

I suppose the discharge on the starboard side could have been for the head (also removed long before I bought the boat). But it is much farther forward. The area that used to be the head is accessible, a chest was built there and I use it to store tools. Inside it is open right down to the fiberglass. I don't see anywhere for a head to discharge to, but there is a wood panel that was added as part of the retrofit to build a storage chest there. I should take that off and take a look. However, this area gets water. It is lower in height than the bunks, and it is the primary route for the water to get to the cabin floor. It somehow seems to run into here before draining into the cabin. I suspect the water moves through the carpeting and that is the low point (water definitely moves directly through the carpet to get to that forward recessed pit).

Another potential route for water, that I re-sealed, was a joint between a fiberglass block on each side of the cockpit, where the throttle control is on the starboard side and where a small storage shelf is on the port side (you can see the hatch in the very first photo, under the captain's seat). I suspected at the time that this was the source of water, because the caulk on the joint on the outside, where you walk around up to the bow, was in bad shape and a moisture was getting into the small storage area under the throttle on the starboard side. That joint is right at the bottom of that walkway, and a lot of water runs past it on the outside. That was fixed by resealing that joint. That is no longer a source of water and that hatch is dry now.

Rick if you could ask your friend Dave about that forward starboard-side outlet, I sure would appreciate it.

-FisherDan

[Capt. Bob]

Dan,
Three things.
1. IMHO, the water in the anchor locker is coming through the hatch. Could you cut in a newer design hatch? Sure, but a drain hole would be less expensive.

2. Mildew creeps. We're covered up by it in Fla. The windshield looks like one of your suspects for sure but I would not rule out the mounts on the hardtop as well as the bow railing along with the cushion. In a heavy rain, water probably stands in the seat depression and finds its way through those screws. Water, and in large quantities can weep through tiny penetrations. I've seen it in roofs and I have had (due to the wet "winter" we are going through in Tally) plenty of opportunity to pinpoint leaks in my cabin. I think you would be surprised at just how much water can pass through a hole with a screw in it. The best way for a roofer to find a leak is to be inside the structure during the storm with a flashlight. I think you can see what I'm hinting at

3. Looking at the 250 catalog cut that Rick posted and the one I have for model year 95 of your boat, I notice two things. One, the head shown in both cuts is a portable and both cuts list overboard plumbing as an option. Two, on Rick's cut, the "features" are cut off at the bottom but are very similar to the ones shown in the 95 catalog. In that (95) catalog, it lists two(2) bilge pumps with mercury switch. Does that mean one switch or two, I don't know I wish that we could see the remaining features on Rick's sheet since the two cuts are so similar. The thru-hull you show on the starboard side is where my forward bilge drains but... I don't have a sink so who knows? Since you said it was capped off (?) that would be the logical assumption that it was for the sink.

[FisherDan]

Bob and Rick - Thanks again for your thoughts.

Rick, could you copy and snail mail, or scan and e-mail, a complete copy of that cut sheet? My e-mail is danbryant@optonline.net; if you want to snail mail, send me an e-mail and I will respond with my address.

I will be installing a drain in the anchor box, and I am going to go around and seal every screw, screw hole, and post joint.

Thanks again
-Dan

[FisherDan]

One more thing, I do have a double switch for the bilge pump(s). When switched up, the bilge pump in the transom runs. Middle is off. When switched down, nothing happens. I am also going to take a look under the panel and see if there is wiring for a forward bilge. I guess I should have done that first   .

-Dan

[Capt. Bob]

Dan,
Is there a float switch that you can access in the rear bilge?
If so, place the switch in the "do nothing position" (auto) and see if the float switch activates the rear pump.

Also,
In the 95 catalog, the sink is on the port side of the cabin. That would explain the thu-hull there.

[FisherDan]

Bob - Yes there is an accessible float switch in the rear bilge in the transom, and it works fine on auto (without needing me to flip any switch). But maybe I am not following your question...is there something else I should test? The bilge switch will also operate the rear pump, but nothing happens when I flip the double rocker to the other side. Remember...I am a rookie boat owner so there is a lot that is new to me.

Thanks

-Dan

[Capt. Bob]

OK then,
The float is wired to the battery.

Let's try something different.
Do you have any storage access through the bunks (under the cushions) on either side or up front?



There has to be some sort of access to the starboard thru-hull, though you may need to hire a contortionist to get at it.

[Capt. Bob]

Dan,
I've looked at your pics for a while now.

I'm thinking that the back side of your anchor hold is the front side of the forward section of your cabin.  

If this is true (and it's a big if)...then,
Since water is getting into the anchor hold, it could be very well migrating into your cabin. One sure way to confirm this would be to fill the anchor hold (simulated rain event) and go below and start feeling around. You may see the water moving into that storage area. :o

The anchor hold appears to have some type of fasteners (?) visible. If so, can you tell what they are attached to?
Filling the anchor hold would at least confirm or eliminate that as an access point. Next step would be to pour water on the bow seat area with the cushion removed and see if it works through the old snaps and into the cabin.

Lastly,and this is a stretch.
You stated that you re-sealed the starboard side panel where the throttle controls are located. You may(?) be able to remove this panel and look back towards the bow with a light and see if the starboard thru-hull is visible and if it is attached to anything or is capped.

Good Luck.

[FisherDan]

Bob - Yes that forward bulkhead wall seen in the cabin, is the aft wall of the anchor box. I am pretty sure that is a major source of water judging just from the water stains in the cabin. It was wet on Wednesday afternoon, after we had a big rain that morning. I will try to check it tomorrow by pouring some water into the anchor box. So I am pretty sure that a new drain is going into the box, and I am thinking about some type of liner.

There is a wood strip on the aft side bottom of the anchor box. Is that the fastener you are referring to? I have no idea what it is for or from. It has 3 bolts or screws holding it, that go down (not back towards the bulkhead). It is heavily rotted. I will take another look at it tomorrow. There is nothing else in the box except the bolts that come in from the bow that hold the ring you hook onto to pull the boat onto a trailer.

I will let you know how the water tests go. Hopefully we don't freeze...it is cold here in NJ! We will be putting the boat into winter storage on Sunday, so I will spend tomorrow trying to sort this out. It goes into a big warehouse for the winter, and I do not have access once it is in there.

-Dan

[FisherDan]

One more thing, Bob - No, there are no access hatches like you show to get into a forward bilge. There might be an access through a wood panel that forms the cabinet installed where the head was.

-Dan