1985 196 Rebuild

[cryder]

Hi All,  Well, here goes.  I've seen lots of great info on this site so i'll do my best to contribute.  I rebuilt a +/-1980 170 when I was in my teens and this was my boat for years after that and I always like the 200 as an adult sized version of my boat. A good inland waters and bay boat.
I've rebuilt boats as small as a rowing dinghy and as large as a Cal 40 sailboat. I needed a quarantine project so, I bought a 1985 196 project boat (it's in the classified on this site) and it now sits in my father's garage awaiting my arrival. My father has gotten underway on the dismantling of it. In the last week I ordered a new tank from Phil at Alloy Metal Works and I have been researching the daylights out of paint.  After WAY too much thought, reading and watching Youtube and almost buying some very expensive Alexseal paint I decided it was better to remain in blissful matrimony and not spend a bunch on paint.  It may be worth it, but?  I called down to Gold Coast Marine Distributors in Fort Lauderdale and spoke to a guy there who once owned a 196 and he was GREAT.  I really have to give them a shout out as they listened and sold me some paint at a great price. BTW, they sell the Alexseal at the best price I could find anyplace. What I decided, with some input from them, it to prime the boat with an intertuf 262 epoxy primer and finish coat it with Interthane 990 in white. In stock it is only available in black and white but OK with that and The price was <25% of Alexseal. I'm looking forward to trying this stuff out.  I used Imron on the 170 and gel coat (what a mistake) and then Awlgrip (not Awlcraft) on the Cal 40. I also considered the Rust Oleum 9700 (sold at Grainger) but decided on the 990 paint that is sold and used locally. If they couldn't sell it they wouldn't carry it.  The boat has some soft spots in the deck, which I plan on drilling a million holes and injecting epoxy into it. BUT I still may have to remove the deck to get to some wet foam. And the transom has the usual small disaster which I have not yet seen to evaluate. When I get going I'll be sure post some pics.  Has anyone used either of these two products, the Intertuf 262 or Interthane 990?  I attached the sales lit.

[cryder]

Hi all,  FYI, I just bought new rub rail at Hamilton Marine which is on sale.  I bought 50' of DWP-92162-FB with the white insert for under $200 delivered.  Should help to dress off the boat nicely.  And, I reached out the manufacturer, Barbour Plastics, with a question on which fasteners to use with it (#10 pan head) and they were very helpful and quick to get back to me.

[RickK]

Sounds like you have things lined up 

[Ulysses485]

I'm curious to see how your experience goes with the paint. What parts of the boat are you going to be painting? Im looking to redo my deck at least but not sure if pulling the cap and painting the inner liner would be worth the effort.

Thank You

Ulysses

[cryder]

Hi Ulysses485,  I intend to both prime and finish paint the entirety of the boat above the water line including the non skid area. I purchased the material to do the non skid from the same paint distributor, Gold Coast in Lauderdale.  I was going to use soft sand after watching a few youtube vids on that stuff but decided that at 1/3 the price I'd use the stuff sold and used locally and bought enough to use the "broadcast method".  I'll start on this project a week from now and will post some pics when I do.  My plan B on the deck was (is?) to use a snap together deck called sport court (https://sporttiles.pro/#all-courts) tiles which I used in another renovation and it worked well there but that was below deck.  It looks good so long as you use a fehn tool, Harbor Freight equivalent, to really cut in every tile with care.  It's very tuff stuff but if you step on a fish on it the results could be a mess for a long time.

[cryder]

Hi All, I re-finished this boat over the summer and I was so busy I did not post any updates.  Sorry about that.  In some broad strokes I striped the hull and removed the console, fuel tank, all electrical, pumps, well everything.  I then replaced the transom which had been built up to a full height flat back and I raised the transom from 20 to 25".  I injected epoxy into the deck to stiffen the soft spots.  I reinforced the console with plywood backer plates and built up the base for a stronger connection. I replaced the fuel tank and all hoses to/from.  I sanded and faired the hull, painted on 3 coats of interfuf, then 4 coats of interthane 990.  I used  "course" awlgrip grip tex in a broadcast method on the deck, fore deck and rear cover boards. I located the new bow running lights on the sides so that I could have an anchor on a bow roller and hause pipe.  This worked well.  I replaced the forward hatch with one I bought.  I made up a hatch for the front of the console out of 1/2" starboard.  I added 1/4" black starboard trim on the console (try to off set the white) with hand rails on the left, right and top (not yet installed).  I made up an electric fuse and switch distribution panel and wired that up.  I ran new main power cables fore to aft.  I replaced all the hinges and latches and bilge pump.  I'm getting tired just writing about this and I did lots more like replace the rub rail, re-fastened the hull to deck joint and made up holders and trim boards for the fishing pole storage areas.  Anyway, as I get time I'll post the steps I did and will most likely start with the tank replacement. I do have lots of pics.

[BradC]

Sounds like a pretty extensive overhaul ... can’t wait for the pictures (worth a 1000 words and less work for fingers)

 

[cryder]

If having an anchor on the bow is what you want, the short shank Lewmar SS anchor I  bought is still on sale at Defender for 125.  it worked very well with the smallest lewmar bow roller.  I failed to take a picture of the anchor in the roller but it does clear the bow and is set on a "shim" of 1 piece of 1/2" starboard just to get it up over the rub rail.

[cryder]

OK,  fist thing I replaced was the fuel tank.  When I opened the coffin hold it looked just awful and was sitting in a pool of water and gas and I though 'good thing I ordered one'.  The tank dimensions were 63x21x8.  The fill hose had deteriorated such that the steel reinforcing was touching the alum fill part and that rotted through.  The vent line was also corroded through. The only leak was that the gasket around the fuel level sensor was gone. When I got it out and cleaned up the tank itself, at least on the outside was in VERY good shape. In fact if I had seen it before I ordered a new one I would have re-used it. It was from Allow Metal and had a sticker on it which Phil at  said made it older than 12 years.  Anyway, I replaced the tank with a new one.  The old fill hose would not come out as it was held in place by the spray foam so I ran the new one around it.  I was able to do that as there is no left to right stringer forward of the coffin in this model so it passed just ahead of the rise to the fore deck and turned to the gunwale. I replaced the vent, draw lines and grounding wires too. I had some extra epoxy primer paint left over so I slapped that on the tank. I drilled a drain hole from the coffin into the bilge and when I placed it back in I put some wax paper on the corners and set it in a few 'globs' of 5200 to keep it from bouncing around as it had worn into the back corner of the coffin. I flipped the deck cover 180 as that had gotten soft where exposed so i had to add another access plate but NBD and I epoxied a 2x6 to the bottom of it on both sides of the new access to stiffen that up below your feet at the helm.  My lesson in this phase is 1) pull the tank, clean it up and give it a good look before you buy another one.  2) Phil at Allow Metal was great to work with and gave a great deal on the tank.  Seriously 1/2 the $$ what others quoted and he makes a great product because I probably could have used the one in there.  3) Don't even try to get the fuel fill line out. Chipping away the foam holding it in place is just not possible.

[cryder]

Next post...the transom.  I had hoped I would be able to avoid cutting into the factory glass but no such luck.  The boat had been made into a flat back and the owner told me he would revert it.  So I did.  I new it had a few issues but it was pretty stiff and this guy used the heck out the boat,  I decided to raise the transom to 25" so I rough cut it down to that height with a circular saw and found that the plywood core was completely gone.  I cut the outer skin off to about 4" from the edge and cleaned out the old core. I made up a new core from 4 30" or so tall sections of 3/4" thick sections of okoum plywood ($250) with offset skarfs in it. I see allot of folks butchering the factory glass work and I wanted to avoid that, here and with the soft deck fix. I mixed epoxy with fiberglass and packed that into the perimeter, panted the plywood with epoxy, placed thickened epoxy on the exposed glass and between layers and skarf joints.  clamped it all in place. let it dry, then built it up again with 7 or 8 layers (thin) of glass mat and epoxy and then used filler to try and fair it out.  It came out OK but I ran out of enthusiasm by that stage so the finish is not perfect.  I did replace the 3 drain tubes as well and that would have been impossible (very difficult anyway) without the swager tool. Lesson in this phase was don't seal 100% the outside face of the outside layer of core until it is set.  It made things messy trying to get it braced.  Also, that transom is thick. so when you have to build it up, in resin it could be done with heavy matt and lots of layers, In epoxy one ends up with a large area to fill to get the thicknesses.

[cryder]

I'm on a roll posting. Next was the stiffening of the soft deck. It wasn't too bad but it needed it. I saw a youtube of a guy injecting epoxy and decided to do that.  I bought a few empty caulking tubes and drilled a hole in the plunger and put a string in it to retrieve the plunger. I started by using a chalk line to snap a grid on the deck.  I then rolled a 2x4 down it to drill holes about every 4" or so.  I used a bit with a tapered stop collar so that when filled the plug is a bit wider than the hole. I used the old access plate as a "dam" at the back and mixed and injected thickened epoxy till it was coming out of everywhere.  I had some fancy plunger injectors I got from jamestown but for production work the caulking tube worked much better.  But what a mess it made.  The end result was perfect and the deck is as hard as a rock with 2, yes 2 gallons of thickened epoxy in it.  Some holes took none and other half a tube.  Lesson learned on this one.  1) the coffin cover is NOT as thick as the deck.  (Please refrain from comments)  2) Do not use the epoxy coming out as excess to level the diamond pattern. I ended up having to scrape it all off and belt sand the deck. Some places it bonded and others it did not.

[cryder]

Rebuilding the console. I took everything off and filled all the holes on the outside. I flipped it over and dug out the wood filler around the edge where it attaches to the deck.  Used tape to create a "dam" and poured epoxy into it to reinforce where the screws hold it down. I added nominal 3/8" plywood backer plates behind the helm, gauge area and top.  I glued on a plywood reinforcing around the inside of the main opening in front.  I assumed that the stress cracks on the corners here would 'telegraph' though so when I made the access hatch out of a piece of starboard I made it wide to cover the corners.  I cut and places black 1/4" starboard for the helm, gauge area and top. I also glued a couple of 2x4 pieces on the inside to fasten an electric panel to.  The console on my 17 always lifted up and it made it tough to hold on tight as high speeds so i wanted this thing rouged.  I chose to place though bolted hand rails (12") on the sides and a 24" along the top (which is not in pace yet). I set the console in a bed of 5200.  It takes a day or 2 for the 5200 to set, which I forgot, about so use the fast cure stuff. Console came out OK a but industrial looking but I'll probably replace the doors I made up with a store bought hatch. I also made up some new drink holders out of starboard scraps.  And, I used starbaord hole saw cut outs to back the hand rails. Sorry i'm lacking pics of the console and some of them are HEIC which I cant seem to upload

[RickK]

Chris - it is better to upload you pics to your free gallery on this site. The site sizes them , no matter what size you upload, to 800x600, which is a great viewing size.
Please follow the instructions here http://classicaquasport.com/smf/index.php?topic=12725.0  - don't attach them - you are limited by file size. Uploading them into your "member gallery" is better for viewing.
Spend a few minutes to absorb the instructions. It's really easy. Remember if using a phone to take pics, to hold the phone horizontal with the lens to the left.
If you can get them to your gallery I can fix the posts to date.

[Ulysses485]

Great work! Thanks for sharing and updating us on your progress.

Ulysses

[cryder]

OK,  The one you've been waiting for.  PAINT.  I started by a rough clean, take off everything, clean with total boat surface cleaner dewaxer, opened up the holes with a wedge shaped recess bit, filled and faired everything with total boat 2 part filler or thickened epoxy or 3M fairing compound.  Honestly, I did not sand enough because of time issues and although most may not see my lack of sanding I can.  I then primed everything with 2-3 coats of Intertuf 262 (2 gallons @ $42./Gal) mixed with thinner at 4:1:1. Rolled with red hawk mohair roller, tipped with badger hair brush. This stuff worked VERY WELL. Cheap, dried hard as a rock, bonded to everything and designed for the Interthane 990 (2@$68/Gal + 1 gal primer at $42) I used to over coat it.  If I had the time and either sanded the primer OR sprayed both the under and final finish it would have come out perfect. BTW, the paint is low VOC but the thinner sure ain't. On the finish paint I did the "other than non skid" area first.  Same application with the roller and tip. On the non skid I used 'course' awlgrip grip tex with a broadcast method. Rolled one layer, then broadcast, then vacuum, then 3 more coast over it which goes fast without the tipping step. I should have sanded the diamond skid down more but it still came out perfect.  The non skid hides many sins. Overall VERY happy with the cost, workability and outcome (for the $ spent) of this paint. If I had the time I would have sanded more and perhaps sprayed it. The last coat went on a perfect application day for roll & tip. I was comfortable with the workability and took my time and perhaps I'm too critical but it looks good, not great. Far from perfect. Perfect from afar. Again, if I had a long new england winter to work on it then it would have come out perfect.